276 · Abadox

• Your home planet of Abadox has been swallowed whole by the deadliest menace in space!
• NES Longplay
• Manual
• This game goes HARD in more than one way really
  • You’re going inside a planet which happens to be an alien
  • All the creatures are pretty gruesome
  • The box art has blood and Milton Bradley together. I don’t recall blood in the Game of Life
  • The game is freaking hard on a difficulty level
  • The least hard thing in this game is the player character
• In the year 5012, the planet Abadox is eaten by a giant alien organism known as Parasitis. Having consumed Abadox, the alien takes the form of the planet and seeks to devour other planets. The galactic military launches an attack but is destroyed by Parasitis who goes on to devour the hospital ship carrying Princess Maria. Second Lieutenant Nazal, the only surviving fighter of the galactic fleet, attempts to enter Parasitis's body and rescue Princess Maria before it is too late.
• Why did they feel the need to rescue a princess on top of everything?
• Abadox sounds more like the alien planet eater and less like the name of the planet
• What’s a hospital ship?
• Any other games where you fight from inside a monster?
  • KH1 - Monstro
  • Life Force final stage
• Downwards Vertical SHMUP (a first)
  • Probably a bigger deal for SHMUP fans
• 1 hit kill, lose your power ups, and restart from checkpoint
  • BUT you get to continue forever from the start of the stage after a game over
• EGL
• Next week - Adventures of Lolo 2
• NEStalgia Byte - Cocoron

Auto-generated transcript. Each paragraph starts with its timestamp. Speakers are not identified.

00:00 Abadox, the Inner War. Your home planet of Abadox has been swallowed whole by the deadliest menace in space.

00:24 And welcome to NEStalgia, a chronological exploration of every NES game released in North America. I'm Mike. I'm Sean. And I'm Joe. Guys, this game goes hard in more ways than one, really.

00:41 Oh? Well, think about it. You're going inside a planet, which happens to also be an alien because the alien is like either... It's unclear to me if he swallowed or just like parasitically took it over. But like, that's pretty hard in itself. The game is pretty freaking hard on like a difficulty level. But the... Okay, yeah. The box art has like blood and Milton Bradley together. I don't recall like blood in the game of life or battleship or any of the other stuff they work on. Um... That was... ...are pretty gruesome.

01:12 What do you got? That was like my first observation because you know, I've been... Recently, I've been going through these games without reading the manual to the positives and negatives that may happen. Um... And the first thing I noticed was this pretty metal title screen with blood on the title Abadox. And then yeah, Milton Bradley right under it. I was... You know, I had that same, uh, cognitive dissonance that I guess you guys must have had too. Uh, I actually did not really look at the cover art. I'm looking it up right now.

01:51 But, uh, I do agree that the rest of it has like a pretty like, um, I don't know, gnarly design. Deliberate. Gnarly. Yeah, gnarly is a good word. Uh, tubular also a good word. I think I heard that. No, no, no. This is not tubular. No, it is kind of. You're going inside the intestines. Well, it might be like literally. That's tubular. Yeah, literally tubes. You're going inside these tubes.

02:12 It's very narrow, the game. It's not the spirit of the phrase, but I understand. Sure, sure. Um, the least hard thing in this game, uh, by things that go hard, not difficulty, the least hard thing in this game is the player character. Uh, it's like a little pipsqueak. I was expecting like a Sylvester Stallone style character or maybe a Jan Michael Vincent, uh, you know, something like that.

02:35 Yeah. Especially with the intro that he gets. Like if you're in a mech suit, you're flying, you got a big gun and then you're very, very fragile. You're so tiny. Like a little baby. I mean, I think he looks pretty, pretty badass. He's just small because you're like surrounded by this giant threat everywhere. But yeah, he is in like an Iron Man suit sort of thing, like with a giant like rifle gun or whatever. And yes, he's very fragile, but like as you power up, he gets less fragile.

03:03 Yeah. But does it really look like that on, on the in game? I agree with you. The box art makes them look tough. Maybe like, uh, I don't remember. He's like a chibi in game. Yeah. I mean, there's just something missing. I guess he is chibi, but like in game I look at him and I'm like, that's a guy in like crazy decked out armor, like suit futuristic armor. But yes, it is not like maybe it's not. Yeah. Like the design is not like as edgy in game. It looks like a baby on one of those swings that's designed for babies and his legs are just dangling out.

03:33 I don't, I don't see it, but I, I kind of get it. I see dangling legs. I don't see the dangling legs return in the game. It's the year 5,012. Um, we'll stop there cause I'm going to make many stops in the plot, but it's the year 5,012. Do you think like people, when people do stuff like that, it's because they want to make sure that nobody ever says like, Oh, well we passed that and it didn't happen. Like this was never going to happen. So I guess it doesn't matter. Right? No, no, no, no. If he, if that was the problem, then he, he could have done like 3,012 or even like 2,090.

04:11 Like you don't need to go that far ahead, you know? Yeah. But maybe, you know, if you're expecting this to be a timeless classic, you want as much, as much time in between as possible. But I also feel like it's like when this came out in 1990, it wouldn't like, you know, there's, there is a level of like for believability. You can't be like the year is 1993.

04:34 That's true. No, that's totally true. You can't go backwards. But at the same time, like when you're going that far up in years, you know, like I, I've never seen anybody use the year 10,000, but 5,000 is pretty high up. Uh, why do you need the 12? Is that like to make it more realistic then on top of the outlandishness? Yeah. What are the odds that happens right on? Yeah. I have a quick question that might be a little off topic for you guys. Sure. Do you think any art that is, you know, recent will be remembered in the year 5,012? Nope. No video game. Not, not a single video game.

05:08 Okay. Well, it depends on the state of the world. I mean, we were, we, we, we, we find, we uncover shit from, you know, from thousands of years ago. I think it just depends on the state, like maybe in Utah. No, right. Well, cause everything will be by then, everything will be totally like isolated. There'd be no contact between states.

05:28 True. I guess I shouldn't say no video game though. Like there has to be, there will be one, right? Like whatever, yeah, whatever. Yeah, exactly. Whatever we agree upon is first, which isn't pong, but like, we seem to all agree that pong is first. So yeah, I agree with that. Like you want to, the same way that like most movies won't be remembered by 5,012. Like, look, no country for old men is a great movie. No one's going to be talking about it in 5,012. Yeah, I agree.

05:56 Uh, all right. So back to the plot. We're going to try to get a little bit further on the sentence here. In the year 5,012, the planet Abadox, and I'm going to stop there, okay? Because Abadox doesn't really sound, it sounds more like the planet Eater, not the name of the planet. It sounds like a virus, right? Like who names their planet Abadox? It doesn't sound like either of those things. It sounds like a toilet cleaner. There you go. Yeah, it does. It sounds like there's bleach in it. Yeah. What was that like cookie that wasn't Oreo, but like was the same as Oreo? Oh, Hydrox. Yeah, right. Oh yeah. I saw that on Reddit recently too. Yeah, we all saw it. It came before Oreos.

06:38 So maybe Abadox came before Earth and then everyone just liked Earth better. That's an idea. Yeah, I agree with that, but I also, you know, Abadox, just remember that like the alien organism that eats the planet is known as parasitis, which could also, you know, convincing, but could have also been the disease that the planet Abadox had. Yeah, exactly. Parasitis doesn't sound quite like a enemy name either. Yeah, like I feel like I've had parasitis. Well, maybe not me, but one of my friends that you wouldn't know.

07:19 Right. Different high school. Yeah. All right. Back to the plot. In the year of 5012, the planet Abadox is eaten by a giant alien organism known as Parasitis. Having consumed Abadox, the alien takes the form of the planet. Okay, now that's confusing. I get it. It takes the form of the planet, like in the sense of it has become the planet, has swallowed the planet whole and now looks like the planet or ate the whole planet. And as a result is now like mutating into the planet again. I like to think of it. Yeah, go ahead, Joe. I would have thought that it's like the planet now is consumed from the inside by Parasitis. Like Parasitis is one with the planet. But, you know, that's just what I took out of it.

08:06 I think like it, you know, let's say Parasitis came to America. I'm sorry, Earth. And what's the difference? Exactly. So it swallows Earth whole. So what you'd see is like you'd see the the outlines of the continents, but it would be as if like you wrapped some some leather around it. So you'd like see the raised continents, but it would be just like the texture of the skin of Parasitis. Got it. So it wouldn't be like that thing that happened in season six of Rick and Morty where like the whole planet got like what was that Joe? They got murned. They got murfed or something like and then they got murked.

08:54 No, it's like, you know, that smiley face alien thing. Like if it sucks on to one thing, then it takes over another thing. And eventually like the continents were like merging into one. And then like from there, the planet became the object.

09:08 Bad example, because I can't remember what it was called, but I don't think it would actually matter. I don't think it would matter if you knew the name because the concept is the same. So, yeah, I get it. Yeah, I get it. Okay. So we're getting cleared up on a lot of these things. I feel like I'm really starting to understand the plot because now the alien Parasitis has taken form of the planet and seeks to devour other planets.

09:30 A very like Galactus style thing. I can't have enough just eating one planet. That's my thing. Now I eat all planets. So before that, it was just eating like asteroids. Then it had its first planet and it was like, holy shit. Like I think that raises another question. Like if it's taken the form of a planet, why is it now eating other planets? I can't visualize a planet eating another planet.

09:54 Wouldn't weird stuff start happening to like gravity as it moved towards the other planet? Yeah, I feel like it would get crushed. It's not like there are like people living on it, right? It's all these like alien parasite things now. So maybe they are equipped for greater gravity. Like the planet itself? I guess I could know that like all these little things that are attacking you. Oh, okay. Like, but I guess now what I'm confused about is like, so are you just trying to save other planets, not your home planet? Your home planet is doomed. Yeah, I don't think you can save Abadox.

10:27 Interesting. That's actually kind of an interesting like difference from like most of these games where it's like, look, this is hopeless, but you can at least stop this from happening to other planets. And then you can go live on one of those other planets. That's true. Is that kind of like the plot of Titan A.E.? I can't quite remember. Remember that game, that movie? I remember the movie. I never saw it though. Okay. All right. Maybe it's not.

10:52 With Parasitis's goal to devour other planets, the galactic military launches an attack, but it is destroyed by Parasitis. That's interesting. Like you're late to that part of the story. Like before the game has even begun, you are the last hope. The entire galactic military has been wiped out. That implies a lot of things have happened. Like we're under a one galactic government. It's the year 5,012. Yeah. It's not that unrealistic. Yeah. It just keeps throwing more information about the world at me in this like one paragraph. Yeah. Because I'm like, okay, so I guess you're not like just like selflessly being like, oh, I'll go save other planets. Like you still live within the like, the government of this galaxy.

11:36 You signed a contract. Right. So you have to. And so, I mean like, you know, look, this plot is pretty damn good. It's got a lot to dissect. Like I could see Ridley Scott making a movie like this. Like I'm all on board. And then it's about to jump the shark violently with this next line. Okay. The galactic military launches an attack, but it is destroyed by Parasitis, who goes on to devour the hospital ship carrying Princess Maria. Now we need to unpack two things. What's a hospital ship? And why is Princess Maria inside that hospital ship?

12:12 And it isn't Princess Maria now dead if the hospital ship was eaten alive by the planet? Well, as we can see here, it is capable of swallowing things whole. So it's not, you know, a total, like, you know, it's, it's like that whale story and the Pinocchio Jonah. Yeah. Pinocchio. It's like Pinocchio. Like he may still be in there or she, sorry, the, the whole hospital ship may still be in there for all we know. It's a planet. Um, so, you know, not all hope is lost. I think it's strange that it would go from priority eat planet to priority eat a very small ship in comparison, you know, like I would want to eat something bigger.

12:59 Yeah. And so is it not explained why she's on the hospital ship? Does that just like inject a little more drama in it? Like, and she was sick. So I don't think it's explained who she is. It's not explained who she is. Like is she, is there one princess that rules the entire galactic military or is she just like one of many princesses? Maybe it's like a Naboo situation where like, she's the princess of Abadox, but you know, she's just a senator or other. I don't know. But Abadox has been taken over by parasitis.

13:28 So what good is she anymore? In fact, if she doesn't even have land to claim as her own anymore, is she really a princess of anything? Well, now we're just talking about the idea of sovereignty. And I think that's outside the scope of this podcast. Understood. All right. So you play as- We just got outside the scope of this podcast right now.

13:45 You play as Second Lieutenant Nasal, which again, weird name, but he looks like it. I suppose the little pipsqueak guy looks like a nasal. Well, um, Second Lieutenant Nasal, the only surviving fighter of the galactic fleet, the math checks out there because the rest of them were all destroyed. You will attempt to enter parasitis's body, another fancy way of saying Abadox, and rescue Princess Maria before it is too late.

14:14 My question, final question, and then I'll read the whole freaking paragraph back to you. Why did they feel the need to rescue a princess on top of everything? Like, were the stakes not high enough that like your entire planet has been consumed by an alien organism that now seeks to eat other planets? Like, nah, nah, it's just not big enough in scope. Like, throw in Princess Peach as well. Well, you know, you need to have the romance.

14:39 Like, cause, I think it's unsaid, but Nasal has unrequited feelings with- What's her name again? Maria. Toadstool. So, Toadstool. I think that that might add a little bit to the stakes. Would you save the world if you didn't like, get like a little peck on the cheek at the end? Well, you're not saving the world anyways. So, they're like, the stakes are like saving other worlds. Saving the galaxy! I care about the princess.

15:13 Yeah, we don't know if you can like, develop a loving relationship with the other life forms that are in these other planets that you're saving. So, yeah, you probably want to protect Princess Maria, your last chance at having any kind of meaningful relationship with your own kind.

15:29 True. What's the main character's name again? N'Zal. I said nasal on purpose. Or nasal. To make him sound- No, no, I think you're right, N'Zal, but I was trying to make him sound even weaker because he looks weak. And he is weak. Well, because it just sounds like, it sounds like, you know, N'Zal is like out of like a science fiction thing. It just sounds like a futuristic name to me. Maria does not. Maria does not sound like a 5,000, your 5,012 name. So, I wonder if they're really just like, maybe someone thought like, oh, people today in 1990 aren't going to be able to relate to this spaceman. We need to give them a love interest who just sounds like a contemporary person.

16:07 That's, you're probably right, but I think they could have just done the half measure and called her like, Mariax. Mariax sounds like a split between the two. You know, Joe, they did the same thing in Sonic Adventure 2 Battle where Shadow the Hedgehog is in love with Maria and he wants to save Maria. So, he has to team up with Sonic the Hedgehog in order to save Maria.

16:34 Interesting. Yeah, maybe it's just an all West Side Story thing. Maria is a human. Thank you for checking on that. They definitely keep doing that and it makes me feel very strange about Sonic.

16:45 Can you guys think of any other games where you fight from inside a monster? Yeah, haven't we had like several shmups? I mean, to answer your question, no, I can't think of any, but haven't we had multiple shmups where you fight inside like an organic thing?

17:00 Life Force comes to mind. Life Force. The final stage of Life Force, you actually have to go inside, which is cool. It's a trope as like a gimmick level or not like a gimmick, but it's definitely a theme that will show up in a game, but never the focal point of like the aesthetic of a game. Like this is, I was very surprised by the visual design of this game. Yeah, we should probably talk about that too, because all of the creatures in the game, and I'm using them creatures instead of enemies, they're all pretty like gruesome by eight pit pixel standards.

17:39 Like there's, you know, where you would usually get in a Gradius style game, like similar style spaceships flying at you that you have to shoot down. Instead, you get flying eyeballs. You know, like that's, that's the first thing you see on the screen. You're like, whoa, this is pretty heavy. Yeah. It's got some like body horror vibes. Like I kept thinking of Existence.

18:01 I don't know if you guys saw that movie. It was like a Cronenberg movie, but it was, there was this piece of electronics that it was like a virtual reality video game, but it got like way too organic. And there was a lot of weird like merging of body and technology. And it was super gruesome. That's definitely a Cronenberg thing. Yeah. I mean, everything in this, like even the walls and like the surroundings is all very organic and, and, you know, it feels very squishy, you know, to the point where like, like, I mean, there's a, there's a level that looks to me like you're just flying through a bunch of like intestines.

18:49 And then there are like parts where you have like this fleshy membrane are the walls. And like suddenly that membrane turns into these like grotesque hands that come out and grab at you. And like, it is like, it's, it's definitely like trying to emulate this. Yeah. I mean, Cronenberg is a good, good thought, but yeah, it's like trying to do like this body horror

19:11 feel to it. Yeah. And there's something about, you know, like NES graphics at the time were the best graphics that you had outside of like the arcades and stuff. So for people like, you know, it could have seemed very real or whatever in the same way that like now I make fun of, you know, N64 and PS1 graphics. But when I was a kid, the piano with teeth in Super Mario 64, like scared the shit out of me, like legitimately terrified me. I feel like the first boss in this game is something that a young me would have like shut the game off in fear of because I'm not quite sure what happened to that cow. Uh, I'm assuming it's a cow, but it's also like a skeleton cow with its brain still like intact to it.

19:57 And, uh, I saw of it more of like a horse dog. Okay. I thought it was a wolf. I don't know. Yeah. I guess I see wolf more than any of these, but it also looks like there's like something else attached to it. Like it has like another, it has a third eye like leached onto it. So it's like the skeleton of a, uh, of a wolf. But then like the parasitis has like leached itself onto it and is just like, it's the actual brains and the skeleton is just like being reanimated by the parasite.

20:29 I see. Talk about like what really like one, like bosses that freaked that are freaky. A few bosses later, I think it's like, I mean, there's a lot of like mini bosses and stuff too. So I don't know which one you'd consider it, but it's like maybe stage five or something.

20:44 There's that like thing that it's like, it's like a giant humanoid red gross man who out of his chest is an eyeball and like his head, his head curves around to the top of the screen. He's looking down on you as you're like fighting it. Like it's hard to describe, but it is that is to me was like the most like unsettling boss. Yeah, there's, there's those kinds of bosses. And then at some point you get like a fish with a helmet, which is a little less scary, but overall like very unique boss designs.

21:17 Yeah. Even the ones that are following the, uh, you know, the greatest like shoot the core style where it's like, there's an eyeball, um, that you just have to keep hitting as the weak point. That's like, yeah, there's a gigantic eyeball and it's attached to a, like, you know, a person's chest or whatever. It's like, that's, it's like, why'd you have to go the extra distance? Like, just give me the eyeball. Like that's scary enough to shoot at. Now you're like, you know, it's coming out of somebody's chest. Like that's insane. And I think one that, uh, I think this, we're talking about a different one.

21:52 It's in one of the vertical levels, um, where you're going through the, the intestine sort of feeling area. And then it's, you, you end up getting split into two paths and it seems like a separate objects, but it's still a part of the background. And you see like, like teeth kind of coming out and blocking your way. It's like a bit of a timing mini game there. And then at the end you see this weird parasite looking thing. So it just looks like, you know, a typical parasite that you might have if you ate some eight year old egg or something. And that was just the fact that it really committed to it and not so much like, oh, how,

22:43 uh, how fucked up can we try and look? And it looked a little bit more like something that could exist. That one was pretty intense. Yeah. That's a really cool one because it's all like you were saying, like, it's not revealed to be the boss when you're going down the corridors. So, uh, then you realize like the scale of the enemy to like the size of it. And granted, you don't have to take it all down or anything.

23:07 Um, it doesn't, didn't start moving. You just shoot the, um, the end point. But like, I really appreciate just not even the commitment to the design or anything, but like, you know, we don't see this even, even in like the sci-fi futuristic games that we get like, um, that are greatest spinoffs. Otherwise like this commits completely to the idea of gross body horror, uh, your inside

23:34 of a living planet thing in a way that also like completely works for shmups, you know, like everything that shoots projectiles and, um, whether they're attached to the environment or as individual enemies, like there's nothing that shows up here. That's too weird. Other than those like pterodactyls at the beginning, I'm not sure what the point of them was, but everything else fits right in.

23:57 Uh, going a little bit into the, the actual gameplay design. I really appreciated how, you know, you've got a unique perspective here because yes, it's one of those shmups that'll change between, uh, vertical and horizontal, but the vertical

24:16 it's going down. And that, that's something that we haven't seen before. And in any other context, it'd be like, why did they do this? Like there are conventions for a reason, but then you realize like what it's doing and it has that commitment to the aesthetic, uh, that you would be going down if you're going through the, the like digestive system of a planet size, disgusting parasite. So I really appreciated that aspect of the design.

24:49 Yeah. And I don't know if this was intentional, but to that same point, like going down, going top down in a shmup like this just feels like, at least to us, cause we've played other, so many other shmups and just games in general, it feels a little off. It feels like unsettling. Like I think it helps add to that feel of like unpredictability or like something's wrong.

25:13 Well, the whole game too, isn't one that lets you explore much. Uh, not that it, not that the rails move fast or anything. It is a shmup on rails. So you're waiting for the scrolling to happen, but it's just that the, the space that they lock for you isn't very much. And if anything, it just continues to get like tighter and tighter, the further you go into

25:35 the levels. And so that kind of creates both a claustrophobic feeling of like no turning back, but also from a, from a gameplay stand of view, there's like, it's really interesting how in other games, like platformers, for instance, sometimes we complain about like how, how, uh, closed in the levels are and the lack of freedom in the jump and stuff like that here. Sure. My, my initial thought might've been to say like, oh, it's really like weird that they

26:04 don't let you roam around, uh, this, uh, you know, this alien creature, but it works. And it also doesn't make the game significantly more challenging by closing you in. If anything, you have to play those tight corners like appropriately. So those teeth that, uh, that keep spawning out, you know, um, they're like fangs. Uh, that's very interesting that it's just a timing thing. It doesn't make the game necessarily any harder.

26:30 You just wait to go around them and everything, but you're kind of locked off and, um, and you're dealing with only like a particular, uh, enemy at that point. There's, there's not like an enemy overloaded any particular instance. It's just that most of the enemies require, uh, you know, some form of thought. You can't just, uh, dodge the bullets.

27:28 it can get away with that. If it were any other, like, you know, boilerplate, uh, shmup game, I might say like, Hey, that's interesting that they at least did something different, but that's sort of like a rule you don't break. Like give the player space to move around. If this is going to be a bullet hell, but because of the theme and the context, it does make sense. Uh, but I will say that those sort of timing, uh, navigational challenges are kind of the least of your concerns when it comes to the difficulty of this game.

28:03 Yeah, I think it, it does play into the, like how you approach, how you approach the game in general, because for me, a lot of times in a shmup, just being not particularly great at them, I like my method or my strategy will be like to try and get past a lot of enemies. Cause I know I'm not gonna be able to like dodge their fire for long or, or take them all out. And so I was, you know, kind of trying to stay close to the front of the screen without getting surprised by things that I can't see. But I did over time kind of realize like this game really felt to me like it was encouraging me to hang back and like manage what's ahead of me.

28:40 Because you, you don't have a lot of places, space to move. So like when you go forward and there's a bunch of like quote unquote turrets or whatever you'd call the equivalent, the organic equivalent of these turrets around, like you're going to get trapped in, in just like a web of, of projectiles that you can't like escape from. So like, I actually found over time, I started using these like obstacles, like those teeth coming out or like other things that were blocking my way for a moment. Like, like as a reminder to like, okay, I can hang back here and shoot things ahead,

29:17 you know, while I'm like kind of both waiting for my opportunity to move as well as like making it safer to move. Um, so I felt like a lot of other, a lot of other shmups have like encouraged me just being like as aggressive and twitchy as possible. Whereas this kind of like made me like for the most as you can in a shmup that is auto scrolling. It made me want to like sit back and think.

29:43 Yeah, I think the worst, uh, part of the game in terms of the claustrophobic, uh, tight spaces is that it does kind of break that rule at times. With the design where certain things, um, that stand in your way are designed to be shot at in order to clear them out. You know, you're like shooting out the intestines and then it, uh, creates a hole that you go through. And then there are other, uh, design elements in this game that are designed to be like, oh no, that's like in,

30:13 that's in the foreground and you go through them and you might not know that, uh, the first time you play through this. And so you're shooting at it, waiting for, uh, it to destroy. And most likely the, the sign would come up immediately that your bullets are going through it. So you too can also go through it. But in a game where like everything counts, it is kind of weird that they like, they set it up two different ways without having two different kinds of looks. There's obviously no like way to do a transparency,

30:42 uh, with the foreground and the background. Yeah. There were a couple of times where those things you're talking about literally were the exact same, like tile set as this, as the walls. So it was like, okay, this looks like more wall, but it's just not.

30:58 One other last thing on the, uh, the navigation challenges. Uh, it, it also, again, I don't know how intentional this was, or if this was just like, Oh, you know, most shmups have speed upgrades, but if you get too many of those, you're probably just going to run wild and very poorly perform them. Cause I, you, you end up getting super twitchy. If you get too many speed upgrades and you just run right into the wall.

31:26 Yeah. It's funny with any shmup that, that gets to that level where you're trying to now avoid power-ups. I definitely know what you're talking about, Sean. And I tried to avoid anything beyond two speed power-ups because I was most likely just going to twitch my way into a wall on accident. But, uh, in other shmups, that's also kind of a thing where,

31:45 uh, you know, if you collect one kind of power-up, if you collect a different kind of power-up, now you lost the old power-up. And so you have to dodge those sometimes too. And I, and I don't like that. And this game doesn't make that mistake where, uh, you know, Oh, you can only have one type of power-up. Like you can collect all of the types of power-ups. And I do think that the game does a good job of at least while you retain all your power-ups, you know, the thing before you die,

32:10 um, while you have them all, it does a good job of making you feel really strong. And like, you can take care of what's in front of you because you're getting all different kinds of projectiles and homing missiles and shields. And, you know, it's not just like one of each two. Like you're, you're moving along. It's just that the issue is, as you mentioned, because the game is so hard, it's, it's a one hit kill. You lose all your power-ups and you restart from a checkpoint. You don't even just like immediately spawn back in with your ship.

32:41 So there's a lot to ask. Yeah. Well, there are several different kinds of power-ups that can stack. Your base fire can get overwritten. Overwritten. So I was also avoiding certain, those are like the different shaped pickups. Um, I know a lot of them have just a letter on them, like we're picking up the bombs or not bombs. The things that orbit you are their own thing. And then there's a missile category. And then there's the speed ones. And then there's your base fire, which can be any number of different spreads or projectile shapes.

33:14 Um, and those can mess you up. If you found one that you really jive with and, uh, you go back to just a, a straight shot, which can really mess with you. Yeah. I noticed that too. There's one I particularly liked was just like a giant bubble. And every time I was a little sad, I would be a little disappointed.

33:35 But as hard as the game is, especially with the reset of power-ups, which I'm sure we'll get into, which we have talked about in other shmups too. Um, there is an interesting, uh, continue forever standpoint that the game takes as well, where, uh, no matter how many game overs you get, you do get to just continue from at least the stage that you were on, not from the checkpoint, but from the stage you were on. So there is a way to, uh, um,

34:02 if you can figure out a way to rebuild up your power-ups and, and learn the level properly, you at least don't have to start over from level one. Uh, a nice, um, consolation prize, if you will, because it is very hard when you lose all your power-ups to gain them back. So we're, it's all, we're dealing in theoreticals here, but I do think that the, uh, continue from the start of the stage you died in makes more sense from a player progression standpoint than starting all the way over. Yeah. I mean, losing your,

34:34 losing your power-ups is punishment enough. I, in my opinion, where like, I feel like a lot of games will tend to overdo it. Be like, yeah, you lose your power-ups. And then if you die three times, you start the whole game over. I think that that, at this day and age, I feel like that just encourages people to be like, okay, I'm done with this game.

34:51 Going inside of a body, of any kind of body, um, this being an alien body. Like, there could have been another way to play this where this game is more like silly and cute and all that. Um, you know, being like playful to the idea of like, now you're in, uh, this organ or now you're in the, you know, this. It's like, it's like magic school bus. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Or that episode of the rug rats where they go inside Chucky. Um, yeah, the, yeah, the watermelon seed, the, the idea here though, I guess what I'm saying is like, it does take a turn as it should where like all of a sudden now there's like computer components and, you know, other aliens with, with guns and stuff like towards the end of the game.

35:35 I'm not saying that that's a bad thing. I'm saying like it could have gone either way. And I'm just more interested on like, uh, you know, from a, from a going inside the body POV, where do you guys stand on that?

35:47 Where do I stand? I don't understand the fact that there's like guns in the body. No, or like, you know, that they didn't commit completely to the, um, navigating inside of, of a body. And instead, then it becomes more like this sci-fi technology. Like you're fighting a robot. And then there's like, you know, a whole, like it loses the whole like guts and intestinal thing and starts becoming more like, it starts to look at least a little bit more like a traditional sci-fi game where you're, like inside another spaceship.

36:21 Yeah. I, I guess I, I will grant that it definitely isn't just intestines the whole time, but there is always kind of a, uh, dark aspect to whatever situation you're in. And you can like, even the ones that, that, uh, that sort of get away from that visceral feel are still like, Oh, that could be bone. And it still looks like there's just weird worms everywhere. It's always disgusting.

36:55 Unless you are in a section that has more technology, but I still think that that sort of fits with the aesthetic because, you know, Star Trek Borg kind of thing. Like, I, I think that they committed as much as they should have. Yeah. I, I'm not like, I'm not against it. I think that it, I think that it's like, you know, it leads to like an interesting thoughts of like, okay, so like this is disorganic thing that, you know, something or someone is building onto it or maybe it's capable of technology or it's merged with some sort of technology or whatever.

37:31 Um, yeah, the part that I'm, I didn't, I didn't get very far in cause I did not beat this game, but the part that I'm like watching right now is definitely like tech, you know, there's like laser beams and like light bulbs and, you know, things like that. And I, I think that that's interesting. Maybe they just thought that the purely organic stuff would get stale or like they kind of started out of the gate with this dark, purely organic, like gross level of like design. So maybe they're like, well, where do we go? Like, what's the next thing? That's like the final thing. We like got to add something new. So tech combined with the grossness is where it ends up.

38:49 And at the very end of the game, another thing that is similar to life force, uh, is that after you defeated, uh, the final boss, you have to escape, uh, from it. And that becomes a twitch reflex. Like, make sure that you, uh, don't hit any of these walls that are just randomly placed all over the place. Um, and squeeze through these little hallways before the exit. And it goes on for a pretty long time. Um, I'm just not sure like how much of that, like, is that a good ending for a shmup where the whole point of the game otherwise was to, you know, as they say, shoot up all the enemies and take down all the bosses. Is it weird that the final challenge is just this like fast reflexes?

39:37 Like the screen is scrolling faster than it ever did during the regular game. And one bad movement will destroy you. Like it seems, seems misplaced. I think it works. Um, I mean, I didn't get to this point because again, the game is very difficult.

39:54 Um, but in terms of a, a sort of change in the gameplay loop, uh, to hammer home that this is the close. This is the climax. This is the great escape. I think it works. Um, I haven't experienced it, but in theory, I guess I can see that like for that to be the like final challenge without that ever being like a smaller version of the challenge throughout the game. Like, it's not like the game isn't giving you like, okay, now use what we taught you. It's like now learn this new thing.

40:33 So to that point, I kind of understand like if, if people would complain about that, like, I don't know, maybe if there were other times where you had to dodge things, like, I know you have to do that the whole game, but like not at this speed and not like strictly like this is clearly an obstacle course and not, uh, like fight enemies anymore. And like, there was no other part of the game that was like that. So it feels a little like, wait, where the heck did this come from? But, uh, I'm kind of neutral on it. Just to defend it one last time. Like, okay, if you're going to make me get eaten at the beginning of the game,

41:09 I'm sure as hell going to expect you to poop me out. So that's where I feel. And I think thematically they, they kept their promise. I, I see both sides. Uh, and I understand, you know, that like it spices it up, but also like makes sense from a story POV. I guess I just wonder about like the punishing nature of the game and then to, to change what the game was and make it very punishing at the very end. Like it, I'm sure if you were able to make it this far, you're probably pretty good at this, but you know, you might not, it reminds me of other NES games where,

41:46 you know, if you don't know the level inside and out yet, you might just not be able to react fast enough to know that like, okay, yeah, so there's this center gate and then this is a top left, you know, like some people just like memorize that stuff years later. I don't know if you can have that here. And so like when you die, you go back to the checkpoint. Sure. But like, if you die three times, then you have to go back to the beginning of that level and fight the final boss all over again, except for without those precious power-ups, uh, it feels a little cruel, but it's a cruel game. So let's talk maybe a little bit more about the, the difficulty. Um,

42:20 you know, maybe on like a general scale, like just for shmups in general does. Yeah, go ahead. I do have, sorry, I do have one before we like go too far past, I do want to like jump back to the difficulty of the boss battle specifically. Yeah. Because I thought that boss battles were well-designed and difficult, except for one major flaw that I found in most of them. And I think I got like a little more than halfway through the game. So maybe they get better, but almost every boss I beat was by finding a pretty obvious spot that I wouldn't get hit and just standing there and shooting like,

42:54 and not moving because the patterns, at least one of those. Yeah. The patterns for these, it's like, it's not like other patterns was like, Oh, they're going to shoot this, this time. And then they're going to shoot three and then they're going to shoot five, but it's always moving and everything's changing. It's like, they're going to shoot, you know, 20 bullets right here while they're shooting five bullets right here and three things right here. And they're gonna do that over and over again. I'm like, okay, well, if I just stand in the spot that I can see none of those bullets are hitting,

43:18 it'll never change. There were some exceptions. There were a couple of bosses that then started moving and then I had to like actually beat them legitimately. But most of the time I was beating these bosses by like finding the spot where, and it wasn't like, didn't even feel like like a cheese spot, like a lot of other things where it's like, you wouldn't know this unless like you read some FAQ or something like this is just like, Oh, I can kind of see it. I can kind of see that like, there's no bullets going here so I can just sit here and just shoot forever. Joe, that's just a pro gamer moment.

43:45 What's that? That's just a pro gamer moment, man. I guess so. No, I agree. It is weird. I was a little upset about that though. I was a little, like, I mean, I was happy about it at the time because I was like, Oh great. I can beat this. But now looking back at him, like, I don't feel like I really had that. I really beat those levels. I mean, we have an essential game that does the exact same thing. Granted, that's like one of,

44:07 one of many levels. And are you talking about Gradius? Yeah. But isn't, that's also like, I feel like I can't remember, but I'm, I feel like that's like something that like you would have heard about and probably not something you would notice on your own, like on a first playthrough. Right. Maybe. It's not like really obvious. Yeah. Maybe. Well, I don't know if it's kind of obvious if like you're saying, like, if you just look at the way that the volcanoes shoot out, you might say like, Oh, I just noticed that if I hang out right here, they never reach me. You know, it's not like,

44:36 it's not like it's a secret, like, Oh, the, it looks like it hits you, but the, the hitbox doesn't get detected. Right. I'd have to see it again, but yeah, I guess that's a good point. But to, you know, it's also one level. It's not all of them. Yeah. And so I think, you know, I'm of two minds with this one, but I agree like for a game that is so difficult or at least punishing in the sense of how it, how it, how it's just one hit kills and it doesn't exactly hold your hand through the game.

45:05 It is a little strange that they would have exploits like that. That said, I'm happy to, to experience them and to be able to beat these bosses and continue to move on because it is a joy to, to continue along in this game. And I would have hated to like have bosses that were just way too hard that I die on. And then I have to restart and hope that I can get past them. Like maybe, maybe it's like a little bit of that, but in my older age, like I'd rather not spend a ton of hours on the first level of a game. Uh, you know, that's kind of past those points. Yeah. Um,

45:41 punishing is definitely a word I would use to describe this game. And, but, sort of looking back on it now, I, I realize how much that they actually do kind of give you a break in some ways. Like, uh, there's the continue mechanic, but there's also the like little satellites that you get, um, which they're not a hundred percent, but they do kind of provide you some cover when you're in the really bullet hell moments. And, uh, and it's still a, an upgrade that you have to pick up and it, it doesn't change the fact that you don't have any when, after you die. But, but if you're in like a tight spot and you have kind of gotten on a bit of a streak, like, you will likely at least have one of these little orbiting things.

46:35 Um, and that should help you out a bit. Yeah. I mean, it's one of those games that we talk about where like, that we've had before where these power ups make a huge difference. Those orbiting, those, those satellites really helped me. I mean, sometimes I feel, felt like I could even use them deliberately. Like I could kind of run them into things that were coming at me and stuff. And then all the other power ups you get, it's one of those games where the more you power up, the more like kind of like, uh, unstoppable you feel for a little bit until you get hit. And then it is like really devastating to lose those power ups.

47:09 And this one, I felt that even more like, I actually don't think this is like super, super difficult when you have all, when you're fully powered up. It's just, the problem is that like, it's, it's hard to get there and it's hard to stay there for like really long. Like you can, you're really, really good. But then you get like so nervous. Like I cannot lose these power ups because then I'm dead like every time. So it's hard to get there. But once you're there, it's like you,

47:35 you're so, um, attached to it. Cause you, you know, it makes, it makes me even more nervous. It becomes a psychological thing. Yeah. And then there's the possibility that it also feels so good to be fully powered that you could chase that feeling. Uh, after a, uh, after a death and want to, uh, you know, continue to play. It doesn't have to be, uh, so soul crushing to be like, well, well I could never come back from that. The, the unlimited continues does make it possible to persevere and play on and learn the levels.

48:09 Yeah. And, and one other aspect of the difficulty, um, I can't really tell if it was in, in like a, an overt design decision or if it was a side effect of technical limitations, but you know, we, the, it always kind of, uh, it's always a, a variable in these shmups. How many projectiles can you have on the screen at once? Or how many times can you press the button and it shoots a new one? Cause I know that like with spread weapons and like with all the other things that like the other, like missiles, like you can have a lot of, uh, projectiles that you've shot on the screen. Um, but in terms of bursts, like you pressing the button and then all of them happening,

49:03 you can only have, I think two or maybe even one with, with certain, uh, with certain upgrades of these, uh, of these like bullets or bullet, uh, bursts on the screen at once. So like you can't, that we, I would just spam and I might contribute to why I wasn't that great at this game. But, uh, you're not going to get the fire rate that you're expecting. Do you guys kind of know what I'm saying? Yeah, no, it's, it's all about fire rate too, because think about if you were able to, uh, sort of turbo it,

49:39 right. And just constantly have a spread in front of you, uh, it would tone down the difficulty considerably because you almost have like a wall of projectiles protected from the front on top of your, uh, shield balls. I don't know if we've came up with an official name for these things. We keep saying different things. I like shield balls. Yeah. These shield balls around you. Uh, so yeah, I totally agree with that. Again, probably a, um, an intentional design decision, but, um, you know, it, it is something that once again makes the game a little bit harder.

50:16 There's no sequel, um, for Abadox, which is a little disappointing, but also I gave credit to Milton Bradley, but they just published this game. this game was developed by Natsume, uh, who apparently make a ton of great NES games. Um, so we'll, uh, I'm looking at the list. This is our first Natsume? It's not, um, at least I don't think it is. Let me check this out. No, uh, it is, it is our first, it's our first Natsume. So we're going to go on and play Power Blade,

50:49 Dragon Fighter, which I thought we played, but that's Dragon Power, the Dragon Ball ripoff. Oh yeah. really was Dragon Ball. They just removed that in, in our states. Uh, Scat, which sounds really strange. Oh. Special Cybernetic Attack Team. Um, you know, I'm sure that they knew what they were doing.

51:09 Shadow of the Ninja. Um, it just gets weird from here. The Jetsons. They made a Jetsons. Like the people who made Abadocs made the Jetsons. I'm like, great. Uh, I look forward to it. Um, oh, you know what they made? What? You're not going to believe this. Um, they made Chaos World. Oh. That, that Nostalgia Bites game. Yeah, that, we enjoyed that. You would ring a bell. Yeah, we enjoyed that.

51:38 Yeah. So, there you go. Okay, if you, if you want to hear more Natsume before those other episodes, check out patreon.com slash nostalgia. Uh, $5 a month, you get the Nostalgia Bites episodes. And, uh, other than just Chaos World, you get access to all of them immediately. And you can cancel, uh, the following month after you download all the episodes. Like, I'm not going to check on you, but, um, we'd love to have you. Anyway, that was my plug. Uh, back to Natsume, uh, just wanted to throw out that, like, Milton Bradley, the makers of the game of life, were not, like, also the makers of Abadox, the inner war. Um, but would you play an Abadox style board game?

52:16 Uh, I, I think maybe. I think, you know, if you, you could probably sell me on any, uh, on any kind of board game if it's executed right, you know? Yeah, I think it would be cool. Like, my, my gut, you know, I, I'm going to immediately like these, you know, like the games that are not like a Milton Bradley type game, but, you know, like a more, um, you know, a more grown up board game. But I do think it would be very funny to have like a Candyland sort of Abadox game where you're kind of riding the small intestine down. Like, uh, or like chutes and ladders, or, or maybe there's like a, there's like a trouble dice popper in the middle of it or something.

52:57 I would play any of those. Yeah. But Abadox twister. Ooh, what is the mat? What does the mat look like? Yeah, I think you have to, it has to be like, it's a series of tubes. Yeah. The mat is like a cube that you go inside of. And yeah, would you, would you use the Abadox, uh, licensed slip and slide? Oh, yeah, but it's, um, it is a tube as well. Everything is a tube. Yeah. Would you go to the Abadox licensed, uh, water park?

53:32 Absolutely. Only if it's one tube. It starts as one tube, but there are changing paths that you can go down. Well, would you use Abadox style toothpaste? Ooh. In a tube. I think, you know, it sounds more like a toothpaste if you haven't paid attention to the. Yeah, it does actually. If you're just tuning in. Like for like your grandparents or something. It's like a denture toothpaste. Yeah. Well guys, would you vote for Abadox on the essential games list?

54:07 You know, I really want to put Abadox on the essential games list. And that's a, that's a spicy way to start a vote. But, I kind of want to put Abadox on the essential games list the same way I want to put Monster Party on the essential games list. They're just games that I really enjoy. I don't know if they fit the criteria of what I've at least set up the essential games list to be. I don't think Monster Party, Monster Party was like another thing somewhat Abadox where it was really committed to its theme and like the ground rules that it lays down and everything. Like this game is complete. It is a complete game. It has tight controls.

54:49 It's just, just really hard and frustrating. And I'm not sure like by the standard of 2023, it holds up that well. It's definitely like one of the best shmups on the NES.

55:05 But I just don't feel like even though I, even though I think it's one of the best games I've played on the NES, I don't think it's up there with the rest of the essential games list. And I'm going to hold it off for right now, but maybe there's room for a conversation later, maybe along with Monster Party. Who knows? We just have to wait till 2026 for the next essential games list voting. If it doesn't get on here, of course, Joe, what do you have to say? Well, I, I appreciate you saying this game is complete because that helps me articulate my, my point because I particularly don't want to put this on the essential games list. And then when I kind of come up with that idea,

55:48 I'm like, well, I have to defend that. And I, and I really like don't have like a great defense for it other than like, I think, cause I do think this game is good. I do think this game is, is very polished. And I think that calling it complete kind of helps me like, yeah, like that's what it is about this game that a lot of other games, sometimes shmups don't do for me. We're like, yeah, this is a complete game. It feels like they did what they, what they wanted to do.

56:12 And there's a really cool aesthetic and it plays pretty well. I, you know, I mentioned a few complaints I had with like the boss battles and stuff like that, but to me, it just doesn't like, it doesn't hold its head out above all these other games enough to make me think like, oh yeah, I'm, this one's going to really stick with me for a long time. I think maybe even less than what you're saying. Like I, for me, I just like, it just doesn't grab me as much. Like I, I appreciate that. This is a, that this is a good game. And I think it's a play. If you're into shmups, uh, I don't think that it like sticks out, uh, to me as like, oh, this is a must play. So I'm going to say no.

56:50 So it can't be on the essential games list, but Sean, don't let that stop you. What do you say? I, I'm going to agree with Joe that this, this does not stand head and shoulders above many games that we've played on the NES, but it does stand head and shoulders, um, above most of the shmups that we've played on the NES. And I think that's still saying something because I think at least every episode that we're covering a shmup,

57:22 one, one of us, whether it's Joe, me, or Mike, we'll make a comment about how, oh, you know, it's just another shmup. You know, they've got their own rubric. Uh, there's like, you know, does it fit the, the AP style guide for shmups? Uh, what, what are the, what are the upgrades? Like, how does that gun shoot? Like it, it's really just grading a,

57:44 a test where everyone took the same test and the answers should, are all either correct or incorrect. And the, like, it's either a spaceship or world war two plane or a helicopter for some reason. And it just like, does this feel good to play? Everything else is just sort of taken for granted. And finally we get a game. We finally get a shmup that has its own feel to it and actually feels like its own idea. And the whole body horror thing,

58:22 like, yeah, it's a little much, but at least it's not just Greenland on blue. Uh, on blue water with like some bombs that you drop. So if it's going into any essential list, it would be going into the essential smups list. That said, this game is incredibly frustrating. I mean, we, we definitely talked about its difficulty, but we may have understated it. I even sort of gave it a pass on some things because it doesn't kick you back to the beginning of the game when you die, which is the least it could do.

59:00 Um, so I do really like this game for what it stands for. Um, and all of the art and the ideas behind it. But as a game, I kind of agree with you guys. I don't think it deserves to be on the essential games list. I do feel strongly about it. Yeah, I think that I think all three votes are totally valid. They're valid regardless. All you have to do is just say yes or no. You don't have to give an explanation, but I like that. Sean, I got to tell you, that was the most like edge of my seat on what your answer was going to be in a while. I was like, wait, is he voting it out? Is he voting it off? I don't know.

59:39 He said he agreed with you. Yeah, but I, but it was kind of like, I do agree with Joe about this, but you know, so I was like, okay, where's it going? Yeah. Right. Uh, yeah. And I would say, you know, it's not, it's not entirely just a difficulty thing. Right. frustrating is more than just, oh, well you die, you know, like it's, it's, it's about what happens when you die and how far back you're pushed and what it's like to regain from, from dying. Like I think that there's a lot,

1:00:10 a lot of things from a level design standpoint that Abadox does right. And then if they just would have thought about like, you know, maybe this isn't that kind of game, but if they just would have thought like three strikes and you're out, maybe this whole game would be different, right? Like maybe the votes would have been different. I don't know. I can't say that without playing that kind of game, but it's just really hard to say that just because the game is well polished and, um, you know, and has a lot of flair,

1:00:39 it doesn't mean that like, you know, I don't, I wouldn't put any game that's considered frustrating on the essential game. It has problems in the fundamentals. You should just be having a good time when you're playing the essential games list. You should be like, man, these games are just a good time. And I think, you know, Mega Man two is a game that people will think is hard, but you're not going to say like, damn, I hate this game. Like no one's going to do that when they play Mega Man two. I hope. Right, Joe? No, one's going to do that.

1:01:05 Why me? I never did that. They might do that when they play. No one would do that. Whoa. They might do that when they play our next game of the week. Adventures of Lolo two. See what I was doing there? Mega Man two adventures of Lolo two. This is a less, less good seg. Yeah. Well, you know, I'm trying here, but adventures of Lolo two, as far as I can tell, has nothing to do with planets being swallowed whole by alien parasites. So we're just going to have to, you know, find connections elsewhere.

1:01:38 Adventures of Lolo is on the essential games list. So you'll have to definitely tune into this one to find out if adventures of Lolo two is on the essential games list. I mean, think about it. Mega Man one and Mega Man two are on the essential games list. You never know.

1:02:08 And, and, and, the, the,!!!!!! the,!!!!!! Thank you.