151 · Skate or Die

• Psych up for 5 of the raddest skating events ever
• Introductions
  • Skate or Die! was Electronic Arts' first in-house game, i.e. the first developed by full-time employees. All prior EA titles had been done by independent contractors.
  • But Konami does the porting here so do we judge EA or Konami or both?
• Overview/Plot
• Gameplay
  • The Shop idea is cool and registering your name upfront is a neat way to handle scores
  • As soon as you leave that shop we get NES Jank right away
    • UP TO ACCELERATE?!
    • Doesn’t help that the controls change for each event. So you have to relearn each event.
  • Practice Mode is useless.
  • Events
    • freestyle ramp
      • 10 passes to score as many points as possible
    • high jump
    • downhill race (in a park setting)
    • downhill jam (in a street setting)
    • pool joust
      • In this event, you are in an empty pool with an opponent. The objective is to knock your opponent down with the bopper, and score the most points.
  • Technically an 8 player game
  • Switching from Regular to Goofy Foot changes the direction you turn when pushing the control pad.
  • What’s it feel like to skate compared to Wacky Water Rage
• Musings
  • This game is commonly confused with the Atari coin-op 720º. The confusion stems from the spoken "Skate or die!" yelled in the coin-op.
  • "If you like Skate or Die, drop us a line and we'll see that the nurses read it to (the developers)."
• Development
  • EA vs Epyx vs Atari
    • Electronic Arts founder Trip Hawkins was looking for a way to capitalize off of the success of the Epyx sports games
    • Right around the same time, several Epyx programmers and graphic artists quit over Epyx' decision to bring Atari Corporation in to market and manufacture their console project (later known as the Atari Lynx).
    • Trip Hawkins found out about these programmers leaving Epyx and reached out to hire these programmers for the purpose of producing a sports series of games.
    • The idea for a skateboarding style game came from Producer Don Traeger, who had been inspired by a coin-operated skateboarding game from Atari called 720°.
• Sequels and Spinoffs
  • Ski or Die - winter versions of this game
  • Skate or Die 2 - Adventure style game
  • Skate or Die: Bad 'N Rad - GB Game
    • The player controls an unnamed skateboarder, whose quest is to rescue Miss Aerial from the antagonist, ElRad the Evil One.
    • It’s a weird action platformer
  • Skate or Die: Tour de Thrash - Second GB Game
    • More like Skate or Die
    • Sponsored by Santa Cruz Skateboards...possibly
  • Cancelled Reboot in 2002
    • https://www.unseen64.net/2017/06/20/skate-die-reboot-xbox-ps2-cancelled/
• EGL
• Next week - Skate or Die!

Auto-generated transcript. Each paragraph starts with its timestamp. Speakers are not identified.

00:00 Skate or die, psych up for five of the raddest skating events ever!

00:21 And welcome to NEStalgia, a chronological exploration of every NES game released in North America. I'm Mike. I'm Sean. And I'm Sam. Guys, there's a saying in video gaming called EA Sports. It's in the game. Do you guys know what I'm talking about? Yes, that's an old adage. I'm not sure the origin, that's lost to time. That is lost to time. In fact, some say that that was said before video games.

00:52 Electronic Arts actually just said, like, wow, that's such a familiar saying to us, we're just going to include it in our sports games. It's what kicked off the original Olympics in Greco-Roman time. Yeah. It's what's for dinner. Nice. Okay, we're all doing very good. We're all on hype levels here. And the reason I bring that up at all is because Skate or Die was Electronic Arts' first in-house game ever. You know, like, the first developed by full-time employees. All prior EA titles had been done by independent contractors. So this is the people that brought you Mass Effect, right? Not really, though, because they published that one, too. But, like, you get the idea. At one point, they made the games.

01:33 So, wow, I didn't even realize this was Electronic Arts. Like, I didn't even see that in the little footer down there. Well, you were expecting the E to come on to the left-hand side and then the A. Yeah. But it didn't happen. No, but, yeah, this is an EA game.

01:49 The thing is, though, Sean, more likely the reason you didn't see it on the game anywhere is because Konami did the porting here. So do we judge this as a EA game making a video game for the first time? Or do we judge Konami because we love Konami games? Or is it both of them are responsible? I guess this is a Konami game. I like Sam's idea. Why not both? Everyone should be held. In fact, Nintendo, right? They gave the seal of quality. We should always hold them responsible every episode. I don't think that means anything. The seal. So not yet. It doesn't mean... We've been burned too often. It was on Deadly Towers. The seal. So you're right.

02:32 There's always a chance for Nintendo to redeem themselves. I have usually a section for, like, the overview slash plot of the game. And I think the back of the box did a great job of just psych up for five of the raddest skating events ever. That's literally what you get. It's five skating events, five different kinds of skating events. Personally, I've watched the X Games, and even I didn't know there were five. Five different types of skating events. Sam, you're our resident skateboarder. You want to just, like, tell us what's going on in this game? Yeah. So, for the record, I learned how to ollie in seventh grade, and that's about it. It's about the same for me.

03:09 But, uh... So, there's five different modes in this game, just like there are in real life. From races, which is just how fast can you complete this course, to freestyle on a half pipe, to a high jump on a half pipe, where you try and jump as high as you can, uh... To a jam, a downhill jam, where you are fighting with your feet and fists other skaters.

03:39 And pool joust. And... Oh, I was saving pool joust. Oh, I'm sorry. There's the... Who can forget the classic backyard game pool joust, where... If you look in the manual, it says that it was a heated pool that they took the water out of. I don't know why it had to be heated. Yeah. But they specifically mentioned it's a heated pool, so you know it's nice.

04:00 However, like, you know, not to interrupt here, but if you ever watch any episode of Rocket Power, you would assume that everybody's pools are always empty, and that you can skate in them. Jousting is when you and your opponent square off, and you each have five turns to go up and down either side of a pool, uh, while holding one of those giant Q-tip jousters, and you have to try to knock over your opponent, and then after five up and downs, you switch, and then you try not to get knocked over.

04:36 I... And there's trash talk beforehand. I love your entire assessment there, uh, Sam, of the game, because I think you really laid out everything this game has to offer. There is just one thing, though. They could have been really lazy and done this, like, town and country surf designs, wacky water rage, or whatever it's called. I came close. But they could have done it like that and just had, like, a menu where you select the five skateboarding events, and then you just go right into them. But this one has, like, you start in a shop, and it has a bunch of, like, neat little Easter eggs. I love this. Yeah, this is my favorite select screen of any game we've had so far.

05:13 And, uh, then, you know, like, there's, like, a hub outside that you have to skate to those events, right? So it's like you're on, like, a street, and you can skate over to the left to get to pool joust, or, you know, the northwest to get to, um, whatever's in the northwest, you know? I know, you know? Who am I to judge?

05:32 Northwest. The northwest is just to go to, uh, that'll be, that'll be... Oh, that's all. Yeah, that's just everything. Everything, right. No, my favorite thing about, uh, I love, I love this select screen. Um, the, this is, like, I know that games like, um, uh, uh, Castlevania 2 had a, had a, had a version of this, but to me, this is the first instance of flavor text, uh, I have seen in a game where it's just, like, you're just gonna mouse, so, because there's a cursor on this, on this screen, you're just gonna, like, mouse over this thing in the background, and there's gonna be, like, yeah, this is the official, uh, jousting Q-tip of, uh, of skateboarding, and just, like, oh, this is really cool.

06:19 And, and then actually navigating a menu in the way that you navigate the game, uh, was, uh, it's just so unique so far in, in how we've done it. So, it's, it's starting off on the right foot. Yeah. And one other thing, when you're in the skate shop, and you have the little cursor, and you hover over the guy who's working there's face, he's like, what are you looking at? Yeah. Yeah, I, I, I think that guy, though, is pretty scary, right? Is he supposed to be, um. He's definitely an ex-marine with PTSD. Okay. I think that's, yeah. If you look at his tattoo, he says Semper Fi. Uh, he seems pretty angry about it.

06:57 Um, I, I mean, no offense to any of our veterans, uh, but, like, just, like, how they have colored this guy's, uh, persona. I mean, what's scarier than the way our country treats our veterans? So. There you go. Tell me. It's been said, uh, and then here's another thing, too.

07:16 Inside the shop, you, uh, you register your name, right? And, uh, you have to put your name in there, and we've never really had a game handled like this where you register your name first, and then it just gets applied to every event afterwards. Usually you have to, like, set the high score, then be asked, register your name, and put the initials in all over again. Here you get to do it up front, but not just, like, as, like, a we'll save you the time thing, but because you can register up to eight people, and technically you and seven friends can all play this game at once, you know, if you follow that logic of, like, everybody just stays to their assigned name.

07:54 I'm, I'm on board with that. I agree. Um, it, it is, it was interesting when I, when I started reading the manual, um, which is a treat, uh, if you ever, if you ever read through it, uh, there's a lot of lore, um, but when I opened the manual and I was looking at, like, the stages of the game and I saw sign in, and I'm like, are we playing, like, World of Warcraft? Are we playing any game as a service right now? It's like, no, you're playing an NES game from 1988. You have to sign in. Uh, I, I thought that that was bizarre, but it's basically just, like, yeah, that's the high score table before you play anything. I think it's really cool because it, it makes it seem like you're signing up for a skate competition. Yeah.

08:39 Yeah, and there is, uh, that's, like, the compete mode where you register your names and everything like that, but there is also a practice mode, and without getting into any of the events or anything, I just want to call out that if you spend enough time with this game, you'll actually find out that practice mode is, is useless.

08:56 Am I right, guys? Like, it doesn't actually do anything different than the compete mode, and the worst thing that can happen in compete mode is that you just, your name doesn't go on the high score. But say you do something really good in practice mode, it will never count. So why not just always do compete? Don't you need to be playing with other people to play compete? I, I didn't. I don't think so. I didn't have other, yeah, I always had computers.

09:21 I thought you had to have people registered to play with other people. Like, you have to register their names. Yeah, that makes sense, that makes sense. Uh, sorry, that was a dumb question. No, it's okay. So you probably played in practice mode the whole time, though. I played in practice mode the whole time, because when I read the manual, I thought the compete was basically, like, the competitive multiplayer mode.

09:40 So, I played all the modes, I just didn't get to save any progress. Well, I got good news for you, though. You, you didn't do anything wrong. We played the same exact game, and that's why I'm saying, like, why even have the option? Like, it just seems strange. Well, you don't have to sign in to do practice mode. Signing in is such a hassle, even when they let you do it up front.

10:00 Doesn't even save your password. Sean, you mentioned that the, uh, the overworld hub, if you will, the hub, we'll call it, because it's not really an overworld, the hub map when you leave the shop to go to those other places, it's, it's definitely has a lot of style to it, and it is thought out, but that is the moment for me where, in Sam's words, the, the jank, you know, that's the moment I realize what kind of game we're playing, you know?

10:28 I, I go out, I exit the shop, and I immediately enter it right again, and I exit the shop, and I immediately enter it. I do not know how to steer on this skateboard, because I didn't look at the manual first,

10:41 but I'm, and obviously I did learn eventually I had to play this game, but I'm making a joke here, because it's true that it took me three tries of entering and exiting the shop before I was able to figure out, like, oh, so the up arrow is actually the accelerate option on your skateboard. So, I didn't have the issue where I kept re-entering the shop, um, but it did take me a while to realize, like, how to move at all. Like, I was able to, like, rotate, uh, which is a, which is actually, like, a step forward in my book, uh, from something like Surf Design, whatever, Roderage, um, but no, I, that, that's what I'm, what I, what I mean to say here is that, like, jank is definitely a spectrum,

11:27 and, uh, if we're gonna compare it to that previous game with, uh, all the cool dudes and the monkey that could surf and skateboard, this is not as jank, but it definitely is jank. The thing that bugs me the most about the jankiness of the controls is that each of the minigames has different controls.

11:51 And so, like, the race game, for example, you, you have to hold A to turn, but that's not like that in any other one of the games, and you can't, like, accelerate while holding A, because then you'll jump, and then, like, you duck when you hold down an A, but you can't speed up while you're holding A, so you have to get rid, it's just really bizarre the way that that one works. Yeah, yeah, I mean, like, you're pretty much having to relearn the game every single time, because even if you get used to the feel of skating in that hub, once you go to a minigame, it has a, it has a little bit of a different logic to it, and so then you learn that, then you come back out to the hub, and you're like, oh, right, right, kind of, a little different,

12:35 gotta figure this one out. Get to the next thing, and it's like you're drunk, like, you just have a whole nother way of playing this one now, and I'm just shocked that it was never, like, it could have been uniform, right? Like, why can't the A button, something that you actually have to, like, press, be the, like, thing that lets you accelerate, like, that's the kick of the foot onto the concrete, like, that feels more natural to me than the up.

13:00 Here's what's funny about that, is that you can tell that they were thinking about this, because they have the, uh, you can choose between goofy and regular, and goofy and regular is actually, like, a term in skateboarding, depending on, like, how you, how your footing is on a skateboard. I think, like, goofy is, like, you push with your front foot, and regular's, whichever. I don't fucking care. I thought goofy was just that you're a lefty.

13:31 Yeah, same thing. Yeah, it's just that you're a lefty. That's exactly what I meant to say. But, like, so they're using, they're using terms in skateboarding to sort of explain, like, are you going to play this, uh, as the directions are on your screen, or as the directions are in relation to your character? Uh, I thought that, like, if they're going to use this, it's sort of to fix the issue of, uh, uh, like, keeping controls semi, uh, semi-straightforward throughout each mode.

14:05 It doesn't end up doing that, but I feel like the inclusion of that select screen, um, tells us that they were at least trying to solve that problem, but they didn't really, it didn't really work. I could agree with that. And, you know, I, I do have a problem with inverted controls. I always need to, like, make sure that games that I play have a setting to un-invert the controls, because that's just how I grew up, and that's just what I'm used to.

14:29 So, that's, you know, that's, like, it's great that they gave an option for that, but it doesn't feel better for me either way. I did try both. And the problem that I had, ultimately, was just that I was wishing for, like, an actual

14:44 redesign of how this game would control that, that would still have to change because the events themselves, because their perspectives are different in certain scenarios of a doubt, like, I get it. The controls would have to change for each event regardless, because it's a 2D game that's trying to simulate, like, some area of 3D, depending on which event you choose. Yeah. But, but I needed to be a little more uniform, because I, I ultimately, like, was having a really hard time switching in my brain between events, specifically with those, uh, the downhill race and downhill jam, too. Like, I just couldn't quite figure out speed versus control versus turning, like, it was Well, there's also a difference.

15:26 There are also weird differences in controls between modes of the same, uh, uh, perspective. Like, if you do downhill jam, I feel like that's the most straightforward of them. Like, you get to choose whether you're going to go inverted or not, and then your controls are relatively one-to-one for some, for a game that has some kind of momentum in it. And then if you do the downhill race, you have the most sluggish version of those controls. You have to, like, start steering, like, a hundred meters prior to a turn. Like, it just doesn't, there's no uniformity, even between matches of the same, of, of the same view, which is weird. So, I think jam was the easiest to control to me.

16:11 Uh, uh, race was definitely, like, no, no, no. Uh, the pool was the worst. But, anyway, you're right. One hundred percent, the controls are just weird for all of them. For me, it was the, the high jump. I could not figure out how the heck, how the heck you're supposed to jump. I looked it up in the manual, and it said to hold a direction and mash B. And so, I would do that, and I figure you have to hold the direction you're going to build up speed, and then it says when you build up enough speed, you can press A to jump.

16:44 And I, I just couldn't jump. I don't know, I don't know how you do it. Huh. Yeah, see, that's interesting, because I, I was able to, like, you know, spend enough time with each event to be able to actually do stuff in those events. I wouldn't say I was getting great scores or anything like that, but I wanted to make sure I could get that. And I think that's the difference between Skate or Die here and, like, something like Winter Games by, uh, Epix.

17:06 Uh, that, remember, that one had that ice skating game, uh, that, like, we just, none of us could even do anything. Like, you'd hit the buttons, and they just literally didn't work. Uh, I still don't believe that that game was ever finished. This one, this one is finished. It's just really hard to, like, wire your brain around all the different control methods. So, you know, I understand where you're coming from on the high jump thing. I think for me, that was the problem with the downhill races. Like, I had, I had that problem. And it's funny, Sean, that you mentioned pool joust, because that was simple enough that it was the one that I actually found to be the most fun.

17:41 That one was simple, but I feel like I could never hit the guy. I would go, like, in, like, just, I feel like my hitbox, or my hurtbox was, like, non-existent. And, well, my, uh, my hitbox, I guess, was non-existent against the other guy. Like, my hits did nothing. I would go right in by the guy, and nothing would happen. And then he would come from whatever angle that's hard to tell. Hit you on the first run. Yeah. So, Winter Games, to me, felt like a game of quick time events without any of the prompts. Like, there was only one way to be, to complete that game, especially the ice skating portion, which was just, like, you have to do it, do this sequence of inputs, or you fail.

18:26 Um, whereas, uh, to its credit, this game seems to actually be, like, you can perform in any number of ways, and you may still do well in a completely different way than another player might do well, if that makes any sense. Like, you can, like, you're playing a game instead of inputting a specific sequence of button presses, uh, in Winter Games. But what I will say, uh, about, um, the high jump is I had the same issue. So, I started using the turbo.

19:03 I was able to get a high jump if I was turboing. If I was just holding down that button that you have to tap down, I was able to do a high jump. But, like, if I was physically pressing the button, like, as fast as I could, uh, I couldn't get any air regardless. So, I'm sort of in Sam's boat on that, uh, in that sense.

19:24 Um, but I also agree with Sam on the, uh, the pool portion as well. Sure. And, and I think that the problem with the pool one comes down to the fact that you, you pretty much have to, and maybe this is the way that it's supposed to be because, like, I don't, I really don't know how many more options they would have. But you have to make your decision on where you're going to go in the pool before you ever see where your opponent is going to go. So, it kind of comes down to, like, rock, paper, scissors, right? Where you really only have the choice between, you know, the left side of the pool, the center, and the right side. You can't change that course when you're actually, like, in the pool enough to make it matter.

20:02 Yeah. You have a very small amount of input. So, you're, you're essentially playing a game of chicken rather than joust, you know, because you have to say, like, okay, I don't think he's going to go here, so I'm going to go on that side. And, you know, that could be fun if you're playing with another person. It's not as rewarding when you're playing with computer because you, you feel like they know your inputs, you know? Yeah, they do. And they probably do. Yeah, you're right. But I'm just saying, like, it's not, it doesn't feel as good that way.

20:30 It's just, I felt like it was a game that I could play, you know? That's the, that's what I'm looking for in Skate or Die right now is which modes can I actually, like, spend some time in and feel like they're working and use them. And Pool Joust was one of those.

20:44 Freestyle was another one, though. I enjoyed the freestyle. Freestyle was the best version of this game because it almost felt like, like a 2D Game Boy version of Tony Hawk. Uh, because, like, you did have different moves that you could do depending on your input. Um, obviously it's just, like, the half pipe. But, um, it, it actually, it felt much more like a trick doing game. Uh, unlike previous versions of skateboarding that we've played. Which is just, like, just stay on the skateboard.

21:21 Yeah, it's weird that they associate, like, skateboarding with obstacle courses, though, right? That's never, not, I'm not calling out this game specifically. Because as somebody that was introduced to skateboarding, uh, through the Tony Hawk games, like, that, that is the version of the sport that I know. Like, there are, uh, very, uh, familiar moves. Like, uh, like stalls and grinds and spinning in the air that you have to make sure that you stop spinning when you're, like, uh, perpendicular with the actual vert ramp. Like, that was the closest thing that I knew. So, I enjoyed that the most. I know that you only had, like, ten trips up and down. So, that kind of sucked. Uh, but I guess, like, there really isn't all that much to do.

22:14 But, again, it's, it just felt the, it just felt the best to me. Like, there, there is a good, there's a good amount of momentum. Like, when you're finally in that mode, uh, that makes the game have that, have that, like, have that feel of you're actually freestyling. So, that's what I liked about it. Yeah, I mean, I would say that, you know, that mode to me, I have almost no complaints about. I think, I can't imagine how else you would handle a freestyle on the NES.

22:45 You know, like, I'm not adding any additional hardware into that. I feel like this got that right. And the only thing I would want, because I always do this to games, I'm not saying it's a valid complaint, is just a little more forgivingness from the game. On, on, like, how you land on the half pipe. Because, you know, you have to, for, in order for it to land sometimes, you have to be, like, very, um, I don't want to say perfect, but, like, perpendicular to the, to the actual, um, half pipe itself.

23:16 And I feel like, you know, you could be a little bit to the left or right and still, like, land that. Get that sloppy landing. Yeah, yeah, I feel like you could get away with that. Yeah. So, that's what I would ask for. I think part of it is the way that they, um, the way that they, uh, designed the way that you spin. It's, like, you, you, you start pressing a directional button and that, that, that's, like, you decide what direction you're going to spin. But then you have to, like, press A to stop. You know, you stop in the middle of the air. And it's not like you stop holding down the, the spinning button.

23:53 So, it's definitely very unintuitive. But, uh, I, I think that kind of contributed to how sloppy we were. Because I definitely fell down a lot, too. Um, but this is, yeah, this is the only part of the game where it felt like skateboarding to me. The rest were just, like, weird, like, they were just weird, um.

24:11 Mini games. Mini games that were not the sport. Mm-hmm. What, you guys don't joust? I mean, I know that there is a, there is a high jump. And it kind of works the same way that it did in this game. At least from the X games that I've seen. But the rest is, yeah, I haven't seen jousting. You don't joust and then trade off. Yeah. Um. I haven't seen that in the X games. The thing for the freestyle that bugged me, there were two things.

24:36 One was on the left side, how there's that little ramp that takes you into it. That I think if you, if you touch that, then you fall automatically. If you try and, like, do a certain kind of trick on that, you'll just fall. Uh. Which I think is really annoying because there's not a lot of space on that side. In that case. Yeah. Uh. And also grinding. If you grind too close to the edge, then you'll just immediately fall anyway. That's true. Um.

25:05 And I felt like that could have been more forgiving. Like, it could have. If you go to the edge, I feel like it should have just let you come back in. You know? Instead of just fall at the edge. That's just me. I agree. Yeah. Do you, do you think you should have been able to, like, earn something in the compete mode that would, that, like, you know, for performing well in this game that you could then, like, go back to the shop and purchase, like, a new color for your board or hairstyles or something? Like, I know that that's silly. Like a Bales video? Sure, yeah. I have an NES drawn Bales video. I like that. Or just a trophy. A trophy, yeah. Or even the things that he has in the shop already, right? Like, it'd be a nice touch.

25:49 It doesn't break the game for me at all, but it's something I thought about where I was like, well, it's weird. You have a shop, but all you do there is really, like, register and get some cute Easter eggs. Like, all right. Or if the guy says something different. I think that'd be cool. Guy's like, all right, you're okay.

26:05 Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, if you score, like, really well. Yeah. Yeah, it seems like the long-term enjoyment of this game depends on if you have anybody to play against. And if they're both able to play it, though, too, Sean. Like, yeah, think about it. If your friend comes over and he doesn't own Skate or Die at his house, you're spending a lot of time teaching him how to play the freaking game first. Or you're just spending a lot of time whooping his ass. Yeah. And give him the Mad Cats controller while you're at it.

26:31 Yeah. uh okay you know one thing musings from the manual here because you mentioned that the manual is a trip i like this line that says if you like skate or die drop us a line and we'll see that the nurses read it to the developers oh i didn't read that part the nurses i guess they're saying that they're insane you know like like a bunch of crazy people made this video game

27:48 dude i i so i mean i loved that that's great but i love the um all the story stuff is like almost standard fare for an nes manual but uh what what really let me know that whoever's writing this is in on the joke was the description of like the regular and goofy uh uh control schemes it's just like yeah this is this and this is that and if that makes absolutely no sense to you please look at the chart below and i'm like okay this guy gets it he's writing it from a place of like understanding

28:25 as opposed to many of these manuals is just like goddamn nonsense so i i appreciated that you know for a game titled skate or die it does get the vibe really right you know like it does it does have inappropriate uh setting and uh like you know from from the box it's art itself to the manual to the language in the game to the feeling of playing these skateboarding events i feel like it is a pretty

28:57 complete package from ea slash konami whichever one we decided we want to judge yeah uh especially compared to the the prior rendition that we've seen which was uh a joke so uh this is leaps and bounds better of a skateboarding simulation um that we've seen on this on the nef you know i want to tell you guys a story about ea versus epics versus atari okay and it all has to do with skate or die

29:32 so i hope you're ready for the ride electronic arts founder trip hawkins that's his name trip hawkins that's pretty cool uh sounds like a skater yeah i think so he was looking for a way to capitalize off the success of the uh epic sports games i say epics epics you guys know it's ep yx you take your guess i'm gonna say epics going forward anyway right around the same time that's uh that they were looking that trip hawkins was looking for a way to make these epics style sports games several epics

30:05 programmers and graphic artists quit over epics decision to bring the atari corporation to market and manufacture their console project okay epics was working on a console of their own later known as the atari links so i don't know what they were so upset about um and the a bunch of epics programmers get upset and they leave and ea is like hold on a minute i'm trying to make a game that's like epics why don't i just hire these guys so he finds out about them leaving hires them for the purpose of

30:37 producing a sports series of games for electronic arts and then the uh producer of the game don trager who came from epics uh said that he was inspired by the coin operated skateboarding game from atari called 720 uh 720 is a game that is often compared to skate or die but i think it really just comes from the confusion that this uh the 720 coin op actually like says in spoken word skate or die

31:09 is like yelled onto the screen so how can don trager pretend that he was only inspired by 720 when he literally stole the game name from from a phrase inside of that other game that that sounds fishy to me the whole thing's a mess and it's it's just the beginning of ea's shady tactics in video games

31:32 finally something substantial for the development uh section of that wasn't a quote though that wasn't a quote no no quotes but i think that's a pretty good story because if you think about it a lot of bad businesses was was done there and nobody nobody sued anybody nobody complained somehow atari wound up making a console out of it got that wild west yep anything can happen and speaking of anything i do

31:56 mean anything can happen because this is just the beginning of the skate or die series we have a few sequels and spinoffs like ski or die the winter version of skate or die yeah ski or die it happened it happens there is much less of a rebellious scrappy uh like characterization of skiing i think more i think that's that's more of like a a rich boy thing yeah i i hear you i hear you and we will be

32:28 playing on the nes skate or die 2 the sequel the sequel which has nothing uh in common with skate or die one except for name because it's actually an adventure style game that's interesting well i'm i'm down i'm down for it i mean like maybe they'll fix the controls a little bit the game itself i'm interested then we have two game boy games skate or die bad and rad i think you have to say rad

32:56 like bad but i would say it more like bad and rad that's the same sounds the same to me no no no like bad and rad and bad and rad so just a very slight emphasis on rad yeah you get it uh in this one it's like a weird action platformer it's not trying to take the skate or die thing from the nes and just port it to game boy we have an action platformer where the player controls an unnamed skateboarder whose quest is to rescue miss ariel from the antagonist l rad the evil one we didn't

33:27 need a story we did not need a story you know they're gonna put it in the manual it's time for a you know a skateboard adventure a proper skateboard adventure skater die underground oh and then we have oh i like that skater die underground that's what we need skater die underground too um and then we have skater die toward the thrash uh can we get some just some credit for that title i mean they're really pulling out every stop yeah this uh this is the 90s this is peak 90s right now and toward the thrash is more like the original skater die that we are reviewing here today and the

34:07 only thing i could find on the game otherwise is that it's sponsored by santa cruz skateboards but i can't confirm that i couldn't i don't know why that's on wikipedia but i couldn't find anything else about it being sponsored yeah it just seemed bizarre and that's that's it for sequels and

34:23 spinoffs we were going to get a reboot of skater die back in 2002 which i will link um to uh you know i'll link in the show notes but it was going to be on xbox and ps2 it was going to be made by ea i think they needed it um but i'm sure ea has a skate series right is it are they the ones who make skate no um or publish it or publish it rather publish i'm not sure though i never played the skate game

34:53 well skate or die never came back um but one thing that comes back every single episode it's just something that we do every episode it's a little thing called the essential games list where we vote on whether a game is still essential long after it's been released i mean this game came out in december of 88 and now in december of 2020 believe it or not december 25th that's right this is our christmas episode uh we are doing the essential games list ho ho ho

35:27 all right guys it's time for the essential games list uh maybe try to be a little merry and bright in uh in this edition so sean you go first uh um yeah yeah uh i'm i'm very jolly uh this game is uh very jolly uh i so like i've i've been i've been very kind to this game uh it's definitely more of a skateboarding game than town and country wooden water warriors but um it's still i mean i there's no world that this is essential uh the the high the half pipe freestyle thing is cool uh it's basically like playing the lo-fi version of tony hawk pro skater one uh but

36:22 uh that's really just three minutes of your time like that's all you need you did it this game is not essential uh uh happy holidays yeah i was gonna say i'm pretty sure you just hurt the feelings of like anyone who just opened up this game for christmas you know like they're like oh i'm so excited oh and nostalgia released a new episode all about it oh all right yeah mom give the gift receipt yeah they gift their seat yeah anyway sam your turn my turn all right keep it jolly all right uh so this game has a lot of pep and i really like that about it and it's it's like you skate around to

37:02 get to each event and that's cool and it's colorful and it's vibrant and the animations look good and everything but it's just a collection of these janky little mini games that aren't they don't feel good to play and it's not fun to play so um it's not going to be essential i would say if they had maybe focused on one or two of these mini games instead and really honed in on the controls i think maybe we could have had an excellent nes skateboarding game but where it is right now i gotta say no

37:39 understood understood and that means that it is impossible to get on the essential games list my advice here is to have yourself a merry little video game let your heart delight but from now on skate or die is not on the essential games list and so we'll have to get along somehow but have yourself a merry little video game maybe something like super mario brothers or duck hunt that's beautiful mike anyway to give the real review though for a second if you could rewire your brain so that you could understand five different control schemes on the fly i feel like this game could be a great game

38:22 for you and you would totally want it and then you'd also have to convince yourself that those five different control schemes are like worth it you know like i'm not even saying that like the boundary to learn them was too high so i'm out i'm saying that you then have to also say like oh this was the right decision like they made the right call here by making the game so different between game modes that uh that i'm really feeling like i'm earning something by by learning all these different things it's not gonna happen don't kill don't kid yourself don't kill yourself either but um

38:53 you know that was weird i said i said don't kill yourself and then i changed it and then i had to go back and make sure that i said it can't skate you don't really have a choice there you go that's the save i was looking for yeah um you know we chose to die tonight if you think about it we we chose not to skate ever again it's not on the essential games list so that means that we'll probably never

39:15 play it again we have many more nes games to go through and uh we also have you know the end of this the end of the season coming up it's the end of the holiday season now that christmas is here but it's also the end of 1988 as we know it there's there's very few games left and that means the best of the 88 is right around the corner folks who's excited okay that's great i'm sure

39:39 the listeners were clapping because i know for a fact several listeners have written into me at the end of every episode they clap they just like go to send you a standing ovation wave file of them clapping no no it's like you know you know you don't get like when the plane lands in america only in america but when the plane lands everybody claps right but nobody like records that it's the

40:01 same thing with nostalgia we will keep recording episodes though and we will have a very special new year's day episode uh next week featuring superman that's right uh just to make it more america show he's gonna be on the show um in the sense that we'll be talking about him not in the sense that he'll be joining us oh i i i feel like he has things to do and also like is superman powerful

40:26 at all in the winter if he like relies on the power of the sun is that a thing yeah the sun the sun's still there it's a little further away colder i know but like uh the southern hemisphere in the winter yeah that'd be cool it's like superman in georgia like they never show him doing anything there well metropolis if you look at certain maps right yeah that must be what it is metropolis is

40:51 based off of atlanta it's still not southern hemisphere okay i think if you look at certain world maps uh sam you'll find it in your heart that only america is on those maps only america's on the map the south of america is the southern hemisphere fight okay uh if anybody wants to fight sean uh write it that'd be interesting his address is in the show notes yeah his address is in the show

41:15 notes but also like write into our twitter account at nostalgiacast we're always doing uh these long post shows but the end goal is always the same write to us uh talk to us let us know you're out there uh we need at least one listener each episode otherwise we won't know if anybody's listening how sad would that be on christmas day and no one's listening to turn the whole thing off yeah so the best gift you can give nostalgia this holiday season even though i said it's over uh if you wanted to just extend it for a little bit the best gift you could give is tell a friend about nostalgia i'm michael esposito you can find nostalgia at nostalgia cast on twitter you can find me at esposito film on twitter and i'll be talking to you all very soon so

42:05 Thank you.