417 · Super Spike V'Ball / Nintendo World Cup
Another cartridge episode, and we had already covered both games. Mike, Sean and Joe were here, and we treated it as a product with a SKU: the Sports Set cart that came with four controllers and an adapter. Most of the hour became a question the show has asked since 10-Yard Fight, which is what a sports game would need to be Essential.
The bundle
- Versus last week's set. We all picked the Power Set with Mario and Duck Hunt, even counting the Power Pad you will probably throw out (or, as one joke had it, use as a towel).
- Not the sports anyone wanted. Volleyball is not a headline sport and soccer is not everyone's favorite. We would have wanted baseball, hockey or football, and been thrilled if the football turned out to be Tecmo Bowl.
- Fine games, no lift. We called Super Spike V'Ball and Nintendo World Cup fine, and putting them on one cart does not improve either.
What a sports game needs to be essential
- A short record. A couple of sports games have made the list, Baseball Stars among them, so the bar is higher.
- Nostalgia is a bad yardstick. Many of our favorite sports games are ones we played young, for the rosters and the stars. Revisited, N64 hockey and Ken Griffey Jr. games are loved for the sounds, music and rosters, nowhere near the best ever.
- What counts as a sport. We settled on this: it has to exist in real life. That puts Madden, NFL Blitz (people on fire and all), NASCAR and motorsport in, and keeps Rocket League, Smash Brothers and Kung Fu kickball out.
- Our picks. Joe went for Tony Hawk's Pro Skater and SSX Tricky because they let you do what you never could. Sean named NBA Jam, NASCAR 98 (with the code that turned it into Twisted Metal) and Madden 08, where he put franchise teams in Mexico City and Calgary. We leaned toward arcade over sim, with Wii Sports, NFL Blitz and Backyard Baseball as examples, and liked the idea of an NBA Jam mode in every basketball game.
- What turned us off. Having to play Blades of Steel before Mario, a rally game that proved we cannot drive one, and NHL games that exposed us as phony coaches.
The bottom line
Skip it. Two games on one cart do not make a better package, and neither is one we would send you to. We never voted: we agreed that offering them together does not put them on the Essential Games List, and joked about a Zelda and Zelda II combo pack. Whether this should be an episode at all got a shrug, and the answer was that it is a product with a SKU, so someone suggested re-recording the intro to say SKU.
Written from our conversation in this episode.
Auto-generated transcript. Each paragraph starts with its timestamp. Speakers are not identified.
Super Spike V-Ball Nintendo World Cup. Bump, Set, Spike, Pass, Shoot, Score!
And welcome to NEStalgia, a chronological exploration of every SKU released in North America. I'm Mike. I'm Sean. And I'm Joe. Guys, we had briefly covered in last week's episode that the reason for this existing was the same reason as last week's episode, which was to sell Nintendo consoles in various bundles. This one being, hey, we published two sports games that both have four-player compatibility. Why don't we just sell four controllers and an adapter for those four controllers and an NES in this game and see if anybody will bite. And let's do it at the same time as we sell a different bundle that has an NES, two controllers, a Zapper, and an NES Power Pad, which everybody wants, right? Everybody wants a Power Pad.
But since we covered that last episode, and there's really not much else to say there unless this just, you know, maybe just real fast sound like a deal to you, which one's the better deal? Definitely last week's, right? I mean, this is great, but I mean, it's like a sport that is not very popular, like not, you know, not like one of the main popular sports, which is volleyball. And then soccer, which is pretty popular worldwide. But it's also like, I don't know, I feel like not everyone's favorite soccer game or anything. It's just like the other one is like Mario and Duck Hunt. You know, it's like they're iconic.
I'd say that even though they kind of force you to dispose of that last peripheral, like it's really just being like, and take this too. Even though you then have to throw that out and like deal with Garbage Day, it's still better value. Or if you're, you know, in Joe's case, you could just use it as a towel. Yes. Use a towel as it. Yes. No, no. Or this time reverse it. Oh, just use it as your towel. Use a power pad as your towel. Because all my towels are in use for being power pads. So I need to use the power pad as a towel.
Yes. I agree. I think it's a no brainer that even regardless of whether the power pad that comes with it works or not, the fact that you're getting Mario Brothers, Super Mario Brothers, and Duck Hunt, and a working zapper. And all that other stuff is just like, it opens up more opportunity for you on the NES as opposed to this one where I really feel like these were, these were fine games, Super Spike V-Ball and Nintendo World Cup. But I know I personally would not have ordered this one. I wouldn't have asked for it for Christmas. It would be like, to me, Joe, to your point, these are not the exciting sports I want.
I want a baseball game. I want a hockey game. I would settle for a football game. And then eventually if I found out it was Tecmo Bowl, I'd be really happy that it was a football game. But yeah, that's like where my head's at. And that's kind of what I wanted this episode to be about because we are always talking about since literally the very first episode, which was 10 Yard Fight, we have mentioned that like, I don't know what it's going to take for a sports game to be on the essential games list. And rather than say what we think an NES game that could be on the essential games list as a sports game is or could be or set up rules for it, I just more or less wanted to explore sports video games in general that we think are essential games.
Games that you, whether they were exposed to you at an early age for whatever console you had and you were like, yep, I still think fondly of this game. Or if it's actually like, yeah, it's still one of my favorite video games, even though it's a sports game. That's kind of what I wanted this episode to be, just to maybe color some perspective on why we don't vote these, historically we don't vote these NES games as essential. I mean, we have with one, right? Yeah, sure. At least. I think maybe there were two, weren't there? No, two. Yeah, there was Baseball Stars as well. Yes, yes, okay.
But yes, there is a higher bar for these games. And so just thinking about it, a lot of sports games for me that I am, fond of are mostly because I played them at a young age and they had the roster that I enjoyed as a kid. The superstars I looked up to.
And I don't think those are great criterias for a good video game. And I'm sure if I played some of those today, I would actually prefer maybe some of the more like bare bones gameplay that's happening here on the NES than on those games. Because the early 3D era wasn't exactly, you know, the peak output for any video game genre. I don't think anybody would say that the best baseball game lives on the N64. Yeah, I think the real turning point was like the PS3 era. I think that's when people started to see them as degrading in quality.
So I would say that PS2, Xbox, those were when most of the great sports games were coming out. Yeah. And I'll be honest. I think I might be not the best person for this experiment because I was not a big sports game person. Both of my brothers, big, big into MLB and NHL. And, you know, I definitely dabbled. But most traditional team sports games, I'm probably not going to vote on the essential games regardless because it's just not generally for me. But I do have some thoughts.
We'll get into it. Yeah, well, I would actually like to start with you then, Joe, just to kind of get a baseline of when you think, you know, greatest sports games that you've played. Obviously, there's way more available than you've had access to. But like what comes to mind as your great sports video games? Well, so, you know, as a kid, it would always be like I'd only be playing these games if it was like my brother or one of my friends.
Like they just needed someone else. And I'm like, all right, fine. I'll play, you know, NHL or I'll play MLB. I mean, those are the big ones. I never really played Madden much or anything like that. But but those like are the ones that I would play here and there. I remember also playing a Ken Griffey game where you could play like on the kitchen table and you'd like the home run was like hitting it over the milk and stuff like that.
That was kind of fun. But I think for me, it's more like if you want me to talk about standout sports games that I would call essential. They're not team sports games. They're Tony Hawk's Pro Skater or SSX Tricky, things like that. I mean, I spent tons of time in Tony Hawk and especially the first one when the remake came out more recently like that. That game holds up. And it is I think for me what it is, is that it's something that I can't do. You know, I could get on a skateboard and go a couple feet, but like I cannot really do anything that's happening in that game. And like obviously, if I'm playing an NHL game, I can't play hockey like the people in that game, but I could like still play amateur, you know, backyard hockey.
Whereas I just like can't even do anything on a skateboard. So it's like a little more wish fulfillment or a little more like amazing to me that I can like I think that's where the fun comes in. Whereas like I can do all this stuff that like I'd have to work my whole life to be able to even come close to doing in reality. And I totally count those as sports games. Like when I'm thinking about this, I would include ESPN NFL 2K5 as the same sports game as Mario Golf.
You know, like I don't achieving two different things, but they're definitely both sports video games. Yeah, but like I think like there and I don't want to call them sub genres, but I think that they are like Tony Hawk. Yes, skateboarding is a sport in a way, but it's not a sports game to me, nor is anything that Mario does. If Mario got onto the gridiron and was like the quarterback of the Mushroom Kingdom mushrooms or something, then maybe. But I don't know. So there was a Mario baseball game. Are you saying that that is falling on the line?
Yeah, I guess it depends. I've never seen it. So maybe tennis. There was also a Mario soccer game. Like golf games are like, I guess those are sports games. I guess it's just whether or not you're considering it a team sport game or just sports games in general. Like I feel like I get what you're saying. I feel like the games that I normally think of when I think of sports games are team sports games. Hockey, baseball, football, soccer. You know, things like that. Yeah, I guess I can see it both ways. It's just a different type of sport. Yeah.
What I'm thinking is that like on the NES, we're considering all these games as sports games, whether they take golf in the simulation realm or they try to be, you know, have fun with it. Right. I don't know if we're calling Lunar Pool a sports game, but maybe we should look into that.
However, I guess that's what I'm saying, too, is like, you know, I totally understand that Mario Golf is not Tiger Woods PGA Tour, but they both, you know, are like serving a similar function that like I don't think people are playing Mario Golf strictly because they love Mario. Like you have to have some interest in golf, too. Yeah. That like Dota or League of Legends. Like these are video games with characters and abilities. And it just so happens that people play them competitively.
I don't know if I would say that that's a sport, but now we're getting into actual like linguistics and stuff. Yeah. Right. I kind of want to like just for the heck of it workshop that line, like where did I draw that line? Because I agree with you that like League of Legends or something like definitely not a sport, even if it's an e-sport or if it's a competitive video game. But like Rocket League, that does fall a little bit on like a line because it's like closer.
It's not a real sport. Yeah. But it's like trying to be like a sport. You know what I mean? It's like a game about like a hybrid sport. But it is like you're trying to score a goal on another person, you know, like because then I wonder like if if there's there's the baseball game where you have like you can like turn into fire and charge the mound and stuff. And like, is that a sport? Oh, it's like baseball. Yes. Yeah. Like it's baseball, but also there's like you have powers and stuff like that. So it's like it's weird.
I don't know exactly where it's like very fluid because I don't know exactly where I would draw the line. Like, no, that's just strictly an e-sport. And this is a sports game. But like, yeah, do we think it has to be based on an actual real life sport or can there be a fictional sport? Is Quidditch World Cup a sports game? Or like, you know, that's what I was going to say is like, you know, I think I draw the line on it not being a real sport because, Joe, even your that game that we loved that's like the kickball game. Oh, yeah. Kung fu kickball.
Like, that's not a sports game, right? Yeah. I mean, I wouldn't think so until now that you've challenged me on that. I'm like, well, I guess based on what I just said, it would have to be. So I don't know. It can't be because then like Smash Brothers becomes a sports game. Like, you know, I would even go as far as to say like Gran Turismo games aren't sports games. Those are racing games and they're closer to like need for speed than they are to NFL Blitz. Yeah. I mean, I guess the yeah.
And this is a loose line, even as I'm thinking of it. But like the difference between like Smash Brothers and Kung Fu kickball is that Kung Fu kickball is two people with a soccer ball trying to quote unquote score a goal on each other. Whereas which is like very much seems like it's taken mostly from soccer with like a bunch of other stuff added to it. Whereas Super Smash Brothers is like here are these video game characters doing the things they do in their video games and they're all fighting each other. I propose that the that we go with the idea that the sport has to exist in real life for it to be a sports game. So NASCAR, those are sports games. Motorsport, I guess, counts.
And NFL Blitz is a sports game, even though they don't they they may like, you know, turn on fire or whatever happens. It's been a while. They do. They do turn on fire. Turn on fire.
But it's still based on football. And but I don't think that like Rocket League, even though it's based on soccer, you are not a car in soccer. So I accept your proposal. I think Joe gave us a good tangent there. And now we can go back to the actual question and maybe get an answer from Sean this time around on like, Sean, just some greatest of all time sports video games that are captured in your mind. Yeah. In order, I'll say NBA Jam when I was truly little. Got to be on got to be on the list. Yeah. So that would be when I had the Super NES played that a lot.
Then it was probably like I think it was NASCAR 98, though. I never really like treat treated it as a racing game. Like, I don't think I ever completed a race like there was there was a code that you could input that gave you a basically like a BB gun that you could shoot like spheres out of the front of your car. And you basically just turned it into like twisted metal on a racetrack kind of. So we me and my stepbrother would would do that. Then Madden 08. I probably played a franchise for 15, 16 in game years and move some teams around. It was really funny. I had a team in Mexico City. I had a team in Calgary.
Then I think those are the three like formative sports games. Everything since that PS2 Xbox era has just been kind of whatever. I think it's a I think it's a solid draft. And, you know, working off of what we're you know, what is a sports game? What isn't and iconic ones I tend to pick is like my favorite sports games, even even though there are actual simulation ones like pick any year of the show, probably. And I think it's, you know, an amazing experience or we were talking about and we have mentioned so many times NFL 2K5.
That's the ESPN one where you can also like build a house or an apartment. I forget. You can decorate a crib. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Decorate the house. Sure. But like, you know, you're doing that in addition to playing football.
The same thing with was MVP baseball 2005 where you can just like set the price on concessions, but also be the batters and play the game at the same time as running the franchise. All those things are fun. But I think the best sports video games in my head, the ones that like I go back to and keep playing are the ones that make the sport more exciting than real life. Like the Sims stuff does a great job of making me feel like I'm in the shoe of those athletes. But it doesn't. Just one shoe. Yeah. I can't wear both shoes. There's just not going to pretend to be in both of Josh Allen's shoes. Right. But maybe one shoe. Maybe I'm cleaning it for him. Just one shoe still doesn't.
These games, though, like, you know, I'm going to throw out some crazy ones. Okay. But like Wii Sports is a sports game. It is a sports game. And I think it's one that like I will go back to forever, especially with other people. Like it was the introduction to the Wii motion controls and it absolutely nailed it. And it makes those games fun. It makes bowling somehow more fun than bowling. Not true. When you go bowling with someone who just can't throw the ball, right? So they're just going to keep getting gutters. They're just going to like no matter what they do, it gets halfway down there and then they just like lose momentum.
And that sucks for them. And that's not fun for you. And now you're just sitting there with some expensive beers and a pretty expensive pair of rental shoes. And it's just not working out. You get two lanes and put gutters, gutter bumpers on one. Come on. It makes the other person feel very self-conscious. I'll say I've recently, my dad's having some hip surgery and he needed me to take over for him for this season in his bowling league. And I've been bowling and I'm like, wow, bowling is great. I didn't know you bowled. I don't. I've been bowling for like the last, like once a month for the past like five months now. And I'm like, yeah, this is like really fun. So I don't know. I have to Wii bowl again and compare.
I guess what I'm saying is like I recently bowled like a 194. So like I'm not, I'm pretty good. I'm not the greatest of all time by no means. But like I'm pretty good at bowling. I'm not disputing that the experience is fun. I'm saying I think Wii bowling captures it completely differently. I don't, I think like that's my point about the games I'm going to list is like we were talking about NFL Blitz. It's like, yeah, I'm glad that people don't turn on fire in real life. But it's such a fun phrase, Sean.
But I'm, but I'm so excited when that happens in this game. I'm so excited when like after the play is over, I just tackle the opponent and I'm just like, yeah, screw you. You know, like the fact you're allowed to do that. I would get in trouble for that in Madden. You would get in trouble. Or they just don't let you do it actually.
Those are the games I keep looking at. But even just the ones that like gamify the sport. Like Mike Tyson, we talk about how that's more of a rhythm game than a boxing game. It manages to take, it manages to think about being a video game first and then working in the sports element. And I think that's what I like about even backyard baseball. It's like such a feel good, earnest take on baseball, even though it uses like real MLB stars and puts them as kids. And the rules are like slightly adjusted and everything. It makes it this way. It's a, it's really just like a fun experience first. And then you're like, oh yeah, but this is totally a baseball game. Yeah, I get it.
I think that there's definitely like a D mark. I mean like, yeah, I guess there already is like, is it sim or is it arcade? These are all arcade versions of sports. So that definitely is still valid though.
And it's fun to like, it's fun to play the latest NHL, but it's probably more fun to actually feel like I have any sense of what I'm doing when I'm playing NHL 94. Like there's just too much, there's too much to going on in, in the sim games now where I feel like, man, can I just, and thankfully we can, can we just turn on NHL 94 controls on these things and play them?
And they, they do let you do that, which is very nice. Um, and I think that that's true of like every NBA game should also have like an NBA jam mode associated with it rather than like the timing systems and, and having to understand proper defense and stuff like that. Like some people just want to have a quick pickup game. Um, well, okay. So I don't know if like not knowing how to play basketball is, but I never felt like I needed to know how to play basketball when I was playing NBA jam. It was just fun two on two, you know? Yeah. Well, you need to know the rules of basketball. You don't need to know how to like shoot. Yeah. And I think that's what I'm advocating for. Right. It's like, I don't want to have to know defensive formations.
Sure. Then yeah, I guess definitely play jam instead of, uh, whatever the, what is it? What's the EA one? Just, oh, it's just, it's just NBA. Isn't it just 2K? Yeah. It's just 2K. Wait, 2K is EA? I thought 2K was like a competitor. No, no, no, no. I forgot that EA hasn't, I think they took a few years off of NBA. Oh, I see. So it's just been 2K for a while. Yeah. Oh.
Well, just certainly back to the Wii Sports thing. I wanted to throw a quick shout out to a game that probably nobody listening to this has played because I don't think it was very popular, uh, which is the PlayStation Move Sports Champions, which I do think was like actually pretty amazing. It's just every who needed it. Everyone already had a Wii and nobody uses their PlayStation to be a Wii. But like that had like, it was like Wii Sports, but with, it was like beach volleyball, bocce. There was like a gladiator duel. And then, uh, oh, frisbee golf. And I think ping pong. And like, I mean, you know, objectively, much better controls than the Wii.
Ooh. Wow. Objective. I like. Yeah. Because nobody bought like a PlayStation Move, but my friends and I, one time we all pooled our tickets together at Dave and Buster's and got a PlayStation Move and this game. And then we would like split it five ways. Like every couple months we'd give it to the next person. And I think we all got like one turn with it before it was lost. But it was great. Lost. Quote unquote. Yeah. I'm pretty sure. You guys might be the first one to ever redeem anything at Dave and Buster's.
Well, we had to pool all of our tickets. And I, I pretty sure one of my friends whose name I won't name sold it without any, without the permission of the rest of us and pocketed the money. Wow. But you're pretty sure you're, you're, yeah. You haven't confirmed that. No, it's confirmed.
Wow. Thanks for the fast closure. Yeah. We took care of it. Yeah. Good. As you should. I just want to make it clear. I'm not against the existence of SIM games. I, I have, I dabble in them pretty often. I just think the more fun experience gameplay wise always comes from the ones that add that video game twist. I do appreciate being able to understand just how hard it is to hit a baseball in real life when I play MLB the show on the actual SIM modes, because once you see what 102 mile per hour up and in fastball looks like, you'll stop booing your favorite players and just resign yourself to the fact that you couldn't hit that ball if you tried.
Well, even then it's like, you know, you're, you're, you're, even SIM games are super simplified and being good at Madden, especially, it does not mean that you would make a good coach or anything like that. I was pissed to find out being good at Guitar Hero. What did it mean? I was good at the real guitar.
Didn't they eventually make one that was supposed to like teach you guitar? Rocksmith, right? Yes. Yeah. They do that for baseball. Rocksmith is the one where you use an actual guitar and then, but like, I think the stepping stone there would be Rock Band, which instead of having five buttons had like the whole fretboard was buttons.
That didn't happen. That happened. That did not happen with Rock Band. The whole fretboard being, being buttons. Yeah. It was just, it was still just five buttons. Well, there was a pro controller or something that my friend had. Oh, okay. Well, that might've happened. Yeah. But then they also charted all those, they charted all those songs again? I'm almost positive. Now you're making me doubt myself, but I'm almost positive. I'm not trying to be like a jerk. I'm just waiting with bated breath because you are both so confident. I'm like, man, one of them's gotta be wrong.
So I'm looking at it and the Rock Band Pro Guitar Controller is a real thing. 17 fret, 102 button peripheral. But I just, I guess like, how the heck do they, but how do they rechart those songs for all those frets? It's like. They just do it. But they were so simplified. They turned every note in the game into just five buttons.
They did it again. But that sounds awesome. But I wouldn't be able to do this anyway, because to my point, being good at five buttons doesn't make you good at 102. But also being good at 102 buttons doesn't make you good at guitar. So it's also just another step. I love the term being good at buttons. Like, this is a good way to describe like being a good video gamer. There's some good buttons. That is basically what games are. Don't you ever see those Nike hype videos where they show like LeBron James like pushing buttons really fast for his reaction times? And like, he's in the zone, right? And it's like, that's what it means to be really good at buttons.
True. I don't know this commercial. Well, the commercial I'm referencing is probably way off the air by now. But, you know, there's always that like, you know, athlete in a training room kind of thing. And they're at the top of their game. But we can't show them in the game because we don't own the express written consent of the NBA. That's true. So they have to wear a generic, generic red jersey with just their number on the back. Just the Nike switch on it. Yeah. All right. So now moving away from the question of great, great sports games. Hopefully we came to some kind of conclusion there.
What is the what is the opposite of that? What is like the the game that you played that turned you off the sport completely or made you like so frustrated that you gave up on like the series or franchise or sport? Hmm. That is a good question. And it doesn't even have to be one of the, you know, one of the core for sports. Like it doesn't have to be a baseball game. It could be a snowboarding game that was like, you know what? I'm done with snowboarding games.
You know what? That might be that might be. No, no. I remember I rented a surfing game and it was it was really dumb. Oh, wait, maybe that was wakeboarding. I don't know. The water water sports are hard. I think it's just hard to make a good video game for a water sport.
Like the one wakeboarding game. There was only one way to really do anything. Have you ever played this wakeboarding game? I'm trying to think of a wakeboarding video game. Yeah, I think there was wakeboarding in Wii Sports Resort. Was there? There's like a wakeboarding arcade game. I always remembered seeing. Wii Sports Resort, Sean. Not the. Oh, I see. That would be funny. They were like, yeah, we got bowling, baseball, boxing and wakeboarding.
Yes. Wakeboarding unleashed with Sean Murray. Oh, it's even had a guy's name attached. Yeah. Never. Was never a big fan of the BMX games that tried to like riff off of basically any extreme sports game that wasn't Tony Hawk was pretty lame.
I did. Well, I did play a cricket game once and that was that was fun because I couldn't understand any of it. But OK. But yeah, there's never been like a really terrible sports game that I was never watched the sport again because of it.
Yeah, I'm digging for an answer here. I'm not sure. Yeah, there definitely wouldn't have been one where I'm like, oh, this is this is what turned me off of this whole sport. But like in the real world, I think just in general, I think just playing. I mean, honestly, I think part of the reason I'm not going to have a specific answer for you. But what like part of the reason that I don't like sports games that much might harken back to like when I was a little kid and my older brother really likes sports games. And I wanted to play Mario.
We'd have to like play, you know, we'd have to play a game of Blades of Steel first before I before we could play Mario. It was like the deal we'd make. So that made me maybe just be like, oh, man, like this was feels more like a chore to me. And I might have maybe that ingrained itself in me. But like I like Blades of Steel now. But back then, you know, I'd always be like, let's get through Blades of Steel so we can play Super Mario Brothers 3. And I don't even think it has to be a bad game necessarily, because my example would be Dirt 5, which was free on Game Pass when I had Game Pass. And I was excited about it. Rally game. Let me check it out.
And it was a mixture of like too realistic for me. But also like I couldn't grasp the concept of like this kind of racing. Like I just wasn't the fact that like the you have to like wear the headphones and the your coach, I guess. I don't know what they refer to that person who tells you when the turns are coming up. But like they're shouting that stuff in your ears and you have to anticipate it. And you're driving in the car and there's mud everywhere. And I was like, this is incredibly impressive. I can't do any of it. I can't drive this car. And it like pretty much turned me off rally games in general. I've tried a few other ones for two to three minutes. And I realize it's every time I can't drive these cars.
Now, has that caused you to not be interested in rally as a sport in general or? No, I want to watch rally stuff in real life. Yeah, just the games. I just know now that I'm not good at them and it's not worth pursuing. But I would want to watch rally for the same reason I want to watch the free solo guy climb buildings. You know, I'm hoping to see something really cool happen. Something really cool. Cool, huh? Yeah, something really cool happened. Something you don't see every day.
And I mean, there's also the, as you could tell from my attitude towards them, the realization that I have no idea how to coach a hockey team. That like, you know, the NHL games kind of exposed me to being like a phony. Whereas like baseball, I feel like I have an idea. You know, like when I play baseball games, I feel like I'm in control and I can manage the team and I can make the plays and I can call the plays. Because the NHL was, the NHL games were like an eye opener where I was like, I guess I really don't know anything other besides offsides and icing.
I'm not even talking about from like a rules perspective. I'm just talking about like a strategy perspective. Like, I guess I really don't understand like skating formations and line changes and shit like that. Like, it just happens and we're lucky to see it. My problem with NHL was always just that like the, the, the, when you change the difficulty, like pro was just like, you can just score anytime you put the puck towards the net. And then all star or whatever the equivalent is, every goalie, like would just read your inputs.
So I could never find that middle ground where like I'd get realistic scores because it's not fun to win seven to nothing or seven to two or whatever. So I think you've touched into something there, Sean, because that is how I feel about a lot of sports games in that N64 PS1 era as well, where once you figure these games out, it's very easy to just win ridiculous games. Like your baseball games can be like 19 nothing. And it's like, you know, that has happened, but it doesn't happen every single time you play.
And yet that's what I was saying at the beginning is like, that's some of the stuff that like the formative games. Like when I think about Wayne Gretzky's 3D hockey or MLB featuring Ken Griffey Jr. Like those are two N64 games that I loved playing as a kid. And I, you know, I had kid like motor reflexes, so I wasn't winning crazy games or anything, but I was having so much fun. But on revisit, like those games aren't even close to the greatest sports games of all time. They were just like for me.
And now I remember the sounds and the music and the rosters more than anything else. Yeah, I feel especially in that area, like with PlayStation 1, at least for me, you just you can't take your eyes off of the how like choppy it is. And it just doesn't feel this doesn't feel right anymore because you're trained on more modern games. And I think like, you know, with with a video game, like with an action game or like an adventure game that that might not be as as big of a deal because like the game is the game. Like Mario was Mario.
But then sports games like you're basically playing the same thing year after year for decades. And I think it's just a lot performance and stuff like that become a big, much bigger deal when it's the same basic gameplay that hasn't really changed over decades.
So to wrap up the episode, I think we just have to quickly mention that Super Spike V-Ball and the World Cup being offered together doesn't make it an essential game. Can we agree to that? Yes, absolutely. You know, I think it's funny, though. It's like if they release a combo pack of the Legend of Zelda and the Legend of Zelda 2 Adventures of Link, is it like, oh, well, now it's on the essential games last conversation. I mean, it's funny because like, I just don't know. Even if it's like Super Mario Brothers 3 and the Legend of Zelda combo pack, I'm like, I don't know. That's not a game.
Right. I still might not be like, yeah, this is an essential game. I would say that cartridge. Us even. Yeah, exactly. We're covering cartridges now. All right. This has nothing to do with the games.
These last. I didn't play the music. I didn't do a fun lead in. I just wanted to get it out of the way that like putting them on the same cart doesn't make it any better of a package. But that's a question. Like, should this have even been an episode? Yeah, but it has to be because it was officially released. But we already covered the games, Mike. Right. But it's a product. It has a skew. Okay. Every product released to North America. Every skew in chronological order released to North America. Maybe we should change the intro. Yeah. Haven't you heard me scanning the barcodes at the end of every episode?
Can I make a suggestion now? You should re-record your intro to say every skew released in North America and no one will know what the fuck it meant until the end of the episode. Ha ha ha! Ha ha! Thank you.
